ERflyer

What do you want Carl? Pay rates or profit sharing? Both for a total W-2 that's better than C2000 plus inflation? $325 and hour plus our current profit sharing formula? What precisely do you want? Your cake and eat it too? We all want that but professionals aim for reality. What is yours?

You're not exactly clear. Go back to translation school.

Karnak

Why can't you stick to that word, instead of couching it in an attack featuring other words like "lame" "tool" "clown" and "toolbag"?

Another attack. Why do you claim I'm "afraid" because I don't have the same expectation as you? Why is it "appeasement" to get a good contract sooner rather than later? At what point do you accept that other pilots in our group might have expectations that are different than yours that are based upon their own experiences, demographics, and priorities?

Is everyone who disagrees with you wrong?

jetnwa

I would have held Reserve CA in NYC maybe 2 bids ago. Just because you can change a "pay rate" doesn't mean you will get a "pay raise" if your costs go through the roof. I have a feeling its not going to matter. I was at a PUB event and saw an interesting graph where we are looking at 2800 or so age 65 retirements by 2021. The DALPA guys can correct me and show the graph if I am in error. Even if there is an age change, that is a lot of training and advancement for the bottom third of the list. Yes, I know the industry is cyclical after my NWA furlough (sans the furlough pay) and two other furloughs at another company all in 2 years. I am very well prepared and have very sharp elbows to survive as needed.

IRT sick leave, again, not our problem esp since we can't bank it. Flight Ops wrote it on the last contract and they can deal with it. I don't abuse it but I don't want to see a degradation of it as the pilot group gets older. They can always go after the sick leave abusers on their own time.

I am always thankful for the South guys to get the Profit Sharing program. Personally, I feel it is "riskier" to combine two funding streams into one. After they come for pay cuts (and get them when the economy tanks), I highly doubt they will would give the same terms and conditions for Profit Sharing.

RA has his job to do as I do mine. He has a current, enforceable contract in place that deals with Profit Sharing, Sick Leave and Training Freezes. More than happy to not be in a rush for a deal.

Thanks for the response.

DeadHead

Why is it considered GREEDY to demand both?

Profit Sharing is not a bonus, to clarify, it is a deferred payment that was negotiated when the company needed help to remain viable.

OldFlyGuy

[QUOTE=Timbo;1874792]

I guess our past C2K Chairman was correct, when he said:

"What did you think that rocking chair was for?"

I'm not sure what this analogy means in this instance. FYI, the rocking chair was just a chair. OFG

Timbo

When they cut our pay 42% AND flushed our DB plans, they didn't ask for one or the other, they took BOTH!

Well, now it's time to restore BOTH.

Purple Drank

My gosh. Could your pro-management agenda possibly be more obvious?

Timbo

Pilot Expectations are managed by the MEC. I guess you weren't at DL South for our 2000 negotiations. We had a great MEC Leader and Negotiators, and they spooled up the pilot group by educating them as to exactly how much we had given up in our previous contract in 1996, lovingly referred to as POS 96.

They had charts and graphs that showed how much more money Management was making in 2000, and how little the pilot group was making, and how far behind inflation we were, etc. In short, the MEC MOTIVATED the pilots to DEMAND RESTORATION, we even had tie tacks that said, "Restore the Profession". We did informational picketing, we had a strike vote, Labor Risk was definitely NOT off the table.

Fast forward 15 years. The Delta pilots have given BILLIONS in concessions, every year, for 11 years, to help save Delta. And now Delta is making BILLIONS.

But not a peep about Restoration from the MEC, as if the Lost Decade never even happened.

Why not? Why no family awareness meetings? Why no informational picketing? Why aren't we in RA's face about his 22% raise? Why aren't they raising pilot expectations right now, instead of lowering them?

What are they afraid of? The Media? The NMB? Both?

All they have to do is show the pilots and the media, and the NMB, the actual numbers for all the stuff we gave up in Bankruptcy to Save Delta; the 42% pay cuts, the retirement funding we lost, the jobs we eliminated with all of our efficiencies like PBS, the lost weeks of vacation, the outsourcing of our international flying with all the JV's, and how the company isn't even in compliance with the agreement they signed.

Yes, we have made small, incremental gains in the past 11 years, but we are still 18% behind 2004 pay rates, with very little in terms of retirement funding if you're in your mid to late 50's now, as so many of our pilots are.

It's payback time. Let's start acting like it.

Timbo

[QUOTE=OldFlyGuy;1874886] What year did you sit in it? When I sat in it, it was a rocking chair, and the purpose was to screen out any pilots with anger issues. I never had any anger issues...until DALPA sold us out, in LOA 51 and by flushing our DB plan, without even putting up a fight.

Elliot

Good post, Mr. Bo


Because it's no longer "politically correct" to have "labor strife" at the Corporate level! I agree we should be asking for the moon, and hopefully achieving the stars along with it, but anyone in the position of power at the D-ALPA level knows they'd be (expediently) replaced if they didn't "walk the line". (Again, not an advocate of settling for $0.01 less than we deserve.)

Elliot