The first half of your post are good questions. We've asked the officers to get those answers.

The second half of your post is wrong.
The flow is not a trickle. We sent more flows to AA than any other. Their chart shows the hiring and it says we got 62% for the year.

We told them since 2013 that all these TA's they tried to force on us - including the one in December 14 - would not solve the looming staffing shortage. We were right.... again.

It's theirs to fix. I agree, abiding by the CBA should be their first step, even if it hurts a little.

Envoy, even with its faults is still better than most regionals. we hear it from the departed eaglets. Many of the non owned places really are shoestring operations. The difference is noticeable if you've been someplace structured before. They all say the same thing. They prefer Envoy but couldn't wait to upgrade. Well, if their flow works as designed - and so far it has - the upgrades times will come way down.

There only around 1,000 captains. 300 won't flow. That leaves 700 that will leave one way or another. We are projected to flow 350 next year alone. That's over 1/3 of our active captains in 1 year. This place is about to turn into an upgrade factory.
We have a fully staffed schoolhouse, we have the sims, we have excess pilots to absorb the training bubble.

 

If AA "hires" 700 pilots next year (a tall order and wildly assumptive due to the unkown number of deferees that elect to return), 75-100 will be from non-Envoy WO's, leaving perhaps a little over 600 to base Envoy's projected flow to AA or a little over 300. Envoy will have outside attrition (which is variable and usually higher in Spring/Summer) and to meet that burden without contracting or stunting the "upgrade factory" you claim, Envoy will need about 35-40 new-hires/month. Each and every month starting now (actually a couple of months ago to "front load" that factory assembly line).

Has that required burden been met so far or is an increasing deficit in progress ?

I understand your motivations for your obscene level of salesmanship here Mason, but again, I think your claims are overly optimistic and based on best case scenarios with no bumps in the road. Additionally, what happens over the next 18-24 months regarding Envoy flow is an equation involving flushing the remaining 824 (about 400 or so left) and not one of long-term considetation involving non-824 Envoy pilots, let alone new-hires of today. Considering the ripness for Envoy's consolidation or other alteration of Envoy, any "projections" beyond the next 18 months or so are truly a product of Miss Cleo.

I have no doubt Envoy management is proud of you though for steadfastly and tirelessly pack-muling so much of their water, but doing so only subjects many potential Envoy new-hires to future drowning when the sweet nectar you endlessly promise invariably doesn't arrive as claimed as it almost certainly wont for many of them.

 

We're already front-loaded. That's why the low-time lines. Anybody hired to keep that true is a bonus until we run out of extras due to the flow and attrition. I would say that actually hiring pilots vs. the lip service they paid to hiring over the last couple of years is evidence that they actually plan to have a lot of pilots departing the airline soon.

How many that actually leave is debatable, but I'd say it's pretty solid they expect people to be going.

 

First, the flows from PDT/PSA are new hires. They are not deducted from the total hired for our 50% calculation; so right off the bat, you're wrong again as usual.

Parker announced hiring of 750, not 700, so again you're mistaken

50% would be 375 next year from Envoy. They can meter to 30 a month which would be 360 for the year; however they have to meet the 50% in the end. So not flowing isn't an option, you're wrong again.

We have about 1,000 CA's and about 300 of them won't flow. That means we are going to flow 1/3 of our Captains in just 1 year. IMHO, This place is about to turn into an upgrade factory. They kept the schoolhouse fully staffed and they kept the sim contracts as if we were still a 3,000 pilot airline. We are overstaffed and starting up a new training program for E175 will not cause a training bubble staffing shortage. The new planes are coming, and we have the fastest flow to AA of all three WO's.

Sure sounds more and more like their 6/2.5 is actually possible.

The pilots will go where the upgrades are reasonable, and the equipment is good. It's been proven already. Sorry it took you a few decades to go to AA; these new kids aren't going to have to deal with any of that.


Just posting facts and numbers. Unlike you, they don't lie.

 

Man you sure do know how to ramble. For those of you that don't want to read the whole thing i'll break it down for you. (Guessing about AA hiring, wondering about envoy hiring, something about how he likes Miss Cleo, insults to Cujo, a crossing of fingers in hopes that Envoy fails)

 

Fixed it for you. He loves to refer to Cujo as "Mason"

 

as far as envoy is concerned, we still have 7 year F/O's who are within the next vacancy bid eligible to upgrade. other than that, the reserve system su cks, the schedules su ck, commuting is terrible. The 4 hotels per month if needed per pilot IS NOT PERMANENT and will be canceled with a 90 day notification by management, junior manning is at an all time high, every one get the JM call. Did I mention reserve here su cks.

Envoy flying still being handed out to others, LAX, SJU, MIA, NY bases all closed in the last 4 years, yeah this place is waiting to explode, explode with mass exodus to continue right after the holidays are over, because the f/os here are still 5 years away from flowing at best.

 

There won't be any mass exodus when you guys get those iPads.

Good Luck!

 

Understand the frustration. I've been on reserve almost 3 years now, but I can say that compared to my last regional, work rules are still better at envoy.

The hotels in base are huge for many of us. No longer have to spend $200+ on crashpads or motel 6's/red roof inns/etc. out of pocket. No longer worry about those cheap hotels filling up on bad weather/high cancellation days and sleeping in the crew room. Many of the hotels they use have free breakfast.

I don't know about you, but I am able to proffer for commutable trips or late reserve reports/early finishes so I almost never commute the day before or day after.

I haven't been turned back or JM'd since last Spring when staffing seemed to be an issue. Lately, most of the flying I've done on reserve is 1 leg - 30 hour layover - 1 leg. For reserve, that is rather ideal, though not for a lineholder.

The numbers of retirements/flow projections are based on objective data. Pending no unforeseen extreme circumstances, we are in a good spot. May be hard to accept that, but things are going to get better.

 

I agree that positive things are in the not too distant future. The hotels do help ease the financial blow of commuting to reserve.
My reserve experience was good until all the flying dried up and CS began pre assigning both 4am and 10 am RAPS for day 1 of a block. Now I commute the day prior every week with the occasional JM on my last day.
As much as I would love to transplant my family and move to base, it will never happen at the rate bases disappear at envoy