eaglefly

Excellent advice. I think that aside from extreme bias of some here that will lead to a strong risk of slanted "information" being given them, information received BY them is at risk to be used improperly considering some of the tactics in play in luring pilots to Envoy. There's a lot of creativity shall we say, in what's being represented about Envoy these days along with a strong effort by some to censor and suppress that which doesn't serve their interests. As I've said before and it's now more appropriate then ever, CAVEAT EMPTOR, as salesmen are on the prowl.

AdiosMikeFox

I don't care who he is, but I'd like to know how he got fired. I've been talking to a couple people that have been down to the schoolhouse lately and it takes a LOT to get fired these days. Whether it's training screw ups or dumb stuff flying the line you'll get in trouble, but not fired. One of the quickest ways to get the company's attention I've seen is to post something identifiable and nasty about the company, especially if it has your name and pictures of our aircraft attached.

cr700

I consider this poster a model student. He's an Envoy Captain and can offer excellent advice to prospective new hires. To echo what this poster and others have said, there are some here with an axe to grind and don't even work at Envoy.

eaglefly

Just because people claim things on this forum, doesn't make them true. I don't know 386's history and what makes you certain others do ?

eaglefly

A model student ?

Are you saying he finished at the top of your sales class ?

I think VERY few pilots view Envoy by what they read on these forums alone, if at all. The REAL information they get is actually talking to Envoy pilots they know who work or worked at Envoy and IMO, THAT is where Envoy's recruitment problems arise from. From my experience, most of the "soldiers" of Envoy out there aren't giving a very glowing review of Envoy and a lot of it has to do with treatment and not just frustration with inflated flow/upgrade claims. That's what I hear when I talk to them and I make an effort at every opportunity if I come in contact with one I don't even know.

I never ask leading questions and just ask "what is the latest" or "how is life....", etc. The answers in virtually all cases run along similar lines.

That's just been my experience and YMMV.

cr700

Yes, a model student. Because of his attitude. It's readily apparent that he views Envoy as a place that has a few problems. However, the benefits far outweigh any negatives here. He will be sitting in an AA cockpit soon while people like ag386 on the outside are desperately trying to get hired at any legacy. I find your posts nothing more than the bitter musings of an old man. One who slipped through to AA when you know you never would have been hired off the street. Why don't you take your negativity elsewhere and let this thread be productive for Envoy pilots and those looking for a career at Envoy/AA.

eaglefly

Now this right here is funny. DAMN funny and I salute you !

In one sentence you trumpet how deserving present and future Envoy pilots will get a career at Envoy/AA implying the flow-thru process is a respectable one to take and then in another denigrate it as an evasive tool for those pilots to "slip through" ostensibly because they are unworthy of individual advancement who cannot get hired otherwise. Then, you buttress that as my questioning of inflated claims about Envoy by you and others (which have proven correct BTW) to be nothing more then the "bitter musing of an old man".

Jesus, if that doesn't reek to high heaven of anger and sour grapes, nothing does. I have to say, it sure is amusing to a bitter old man like myself and actually perked up my morning quite nicely to see you, a bitter middle-aged man revert to such emotion based illogical contradictions and for that I again salute you !

The CRJ-700 is one of the prettiest jets when it flies in circles.

AdiosMikeFox

Silence is telling.

And like I said, I don't care who he is. He went to Allegiant and doesn't work here anymore, I consider that more relevant. Fired on top of that? Then that's another reason to not listen to him.

Why isn't he here trying to help other people get hired at Allegiant? Why isn't he saying how great it is? Why isn't he trying to help people into a better position? Instead he just b****es and moans. If I got hired elsewhere you bet your a** I'd be here helping people out and not wasting my time being a ***k about my former employer.

eaglefly

So you're assuming. I see.

As for "being a ***k about my former employer", not all of us have that motive. My motive is to advocate for new pilots not yet savvy as to the.....well, shall we say "less then genuine" concern for them as pilots and people as opposed for the greater concern of interests of others, especially when it may be at THEIR (the new pilots) expense. Being a ***k about my former employer is not the same as offering another perspective on the conduct and motives of others who are primarily or solely interested in themselves and/or question the information they disseminate or opinions that they too convey.

All to often, those who have a difference of opinion on these realities are incorrectly lumped as those with "an ax to grind", "bitter old men", "trolls" or some other simplistic but inaccurate term to discredit their dissenting opinion and hopefully silence that opposing information leaving those who have less then altruistic motives of other pilots free reign to take advantage of others unimpeded. While many may focus primarily on their EMPLOYERS interests (which really assist THEIRS or so they believe), I'm more focused on PILOTS and them having the ability to dissect all relevant opinions on what is discussed who then can make a more informed decision to do X or Y. As I've previously stated, I don't think Envoy is all bad, even though I get a clearly negative vibe from the majority I talk to still there or who have recently left and even with that, Envoy may be the right fit for some. But be that as it is, Envoy still has significant hurdles regarding its future that at present are NOT being successfully addressed and that is something EVERY prospective Envoy pilot should have the right to consider when making a career decision.

I realize this angers some there though as of course by the admission of many of you, the goal of working at Envoy is to hopefully NOT work there ASAP. If that weren't the goal, the flow wouldn't be the carrot and IMO, Envoy would stand on its OWN career merits like its predecessor Eagle used to as a career-oriented company.

PilotJ3

From the horse mouth "Just because people claim things on this forum, doesn't make them true."

How Ironic!!!! Still waiting for the answer...