^ This. Well said. People are wild with their ready, fire, aim approach over a crew bus rumor. Worse gossip than my wife's office floor.

 

In the “not rumor” category, LEC rep has transmitted that NC will be working this week to consolidate full TA for MEC vote Monday/Tuesday next week (12/13 June).

If TA passes that vote, LEC says expect immediate release of TA via the newly established website.

Looking forward to both the MEC vote results and several pots of coffee with a complex legal document that will govern my work life for years. Hopefully we get to the coffee part happens sooner rather than later.

 

You're in Denial. The last TA presented by our NC and voted for by our MEC passed 57% to 43%. Our current NC wants to present a TA that will pass and preserve whatever retirement "gains" presented as a singular priority.

What y'all call gossip exists due to the information vacuum that is SOP for this leadership team. That said all the grousing about the vocal opposition to the tenor of these negotiations is misplaced. Retirement is one small piece of this deal and the better than 52% of the pilots who've been hired here in the last 8+ years aren't gonna agree to a subpar deal with ever degrading quality of life because you've marginally improved a defined benefit that was in place when they hired on and those here didn't see fit to improve.

By all indications the company is seeking significant changes in the way this airline is run that will likely have meaningful impact on those who remain for future contracts. This contract needs to address those items. If it does not it will be vocally opposed. If the MEC upvotes a subpar deal like they did 8 years ago, they will be vocally opposed. I'm not gonna sit here for another 8 years and live with a @#$% contract without making sure those willing to sellout hear about it. Of course the retirees won't have to worry about it because they will have gotten the bag and gone.

The folks selling this TA will have had years to figure out how to sell what they negotiated as the best and only deal. The rest of us are supposed to wait until they decide to give us the information so we can have a few weeks to decide on the merits and persuade enough people against if it doesn't meet them?!

Its not going to happen. I'm telling everyone who will listen we should get the contract we deserve not some settlement agreement that passes by the slimmest of majorities and I for damn sure aint gonna wait until it is presented to make the case. No one asked them for pancakes, but they used our money to cook that up and (unsuccessfully) serve them. If they "speak for you" and you "trust" them that's on you. The rest of us will be heard from in whatever forum that is available.

PS
If it bothers you too much to hear it, feel free to hit that block button. It won't hurt my feelings one bit.

 

Well it's a bit more complicated than that. This MEC does not get to "sign off" on each section as it is TA'd. The NC makes that decision by itself with zero input from the MEC. The ONLY time the MEC gets a say in any TA'd section is next week - when it can either accept the entire thing or turn it down.

The Company only wants that 51% as you said - and the MEC wants a very high percentage passage - to keep it even for the different demographic groups in the union. Don't want to just have something that helps out senior guys but screws younger guys or the opposite. The only time to stop that is really at the NC or MEC level - once it gets to membership each person will vote what is best for them - as they should. So we can't really see what's being pitched right now - can't really make the argument to our reps why they should or shouldn't support it at their level. This was all planned as it's not normal - normally bullet points do come out. A lot of hay is made during this quiet period - that quiet period is largely to control the process - so that individual reps or NC members or officers don't make statements on their own - things they absolutely will do if and when this TA goes to ratification (we should encourage that - members writing their personal opinion on each section). The "quiet period" absolutely allows bullet points - it just has to be controlled and approved jointly - hence the entire clause "unless MEC allows" - so please don't put any weight on the idea that no one is allowed to say anything. They've chosen to keep it quiet and that should concern everyone here. Sure you can write your reps and give opinions on stuff you have no idea - but not real useful unless you are looking at what is being proposed. And after it comes to the membership writing your reps is useless as they will have the same exact power as you then.

It's a very poor process - likely manufactured to give the best chance to a certain outcome. Definitely not a lot of transparency here. To be fair, this MEC and NC have not been transparent all along and we've allowed it so it's not really anything new for this group but it is new compared to prior negotiations here or at other ALPA carriers.

 

The MEC can ask for and publish bullet points according to the policy manual. They have not.

In '15 a failed TA would have required the MEC asking for the Master Contingency Fund grant. This would have opened our "books" to national. Some were nervous about that proposition.

Most of those retiring now did have five extra years here at the company to save for retirement and one extra contract to improve everything. They collectively made choices.

The tragedy of those retiring without an improvement to retirement has been discussed, but the other side of that coin is the rest of us having to live with a concessionary contract for a gain in retirement which may not beat inflation since our last contract. I doubt that is a fair trade.

Also, If they were proud of their TA (AIP), they would want to show it off asap. Their choices seem to speak louder than they do.


Last question, Our NC chair talked a lot about statistically relevant survey data, I wonder if the gains surpassed the survey results?

 

Do ya feel better?

 

Cue the near retirees creating APC accounts and coming out of the woodwork with doom and gloom to save their special deals while expecting the rest of us to suffer with QOL givebacks and below avg pay rates.

 

"Guys, stop being selfish! Settle for less now and keep your powder dry. You'll have your turn!" - Signed, A pilot who was gifted 5 extra years to work on their retirement...But didn't.

...We really are our own worst enemy.

 

It appears that the retirement gains are going to be traded for QOL degradation and efficiency gains for the company. That is asking the pilots now to work more for less to improve the retirement for pilots whom worked under the old system. I don't see how anyone with a long career here left would agree to that. It'd be easier to figure out a way to supplement our current A-plan with retirement savings on your own. It doesn't make sense to keep trading the good parts of our contract away. Eventually they'll be nothing left to trade.

 

Thought you were taking a break until the TA comes out? You still haven't been banned again yet, eh?