TheManager

The above bolded is an inaccurate fact. You do not get reimbursement when you are away from your "home." You get reimbursement when you are away from base. Driving to the office and back home does not fit the definition of away from base. You think Delta pays anyone working at the GO per diem? There's your facts.

A. Definitions
1. “Domestic per diem” means the hourly meal allowance for time away from base that is
applicable to a pilot while engaged in domestic operations.
2. “International per diem” means the hourly meal allowance for time away from base that
is applicable to a pilot while engaged in international operations.
Note: An international category pilot assigned to training away from base will receive
domestic per diem.
3. “Time away from base” means the period beginning with report at base and ending upon
release at base.
Exception: The “time away from base” of a pilot who is assigned to training away from
base will end at block-in at his base.
Note: See

2. International per diem: $2.50.

Carl Spackler

That's really not correct. ALPA was a union 25-30 years ago. Many huge gains were made by pilot groups who fought hard - including strikes by Northwest, United, Eastern, etc. I agree ALPA is failing badly today, but it wasn't always that way.

Absolutely correct. Also, APA brought us the wholesale outsourcing of jobs with Eagle RJ's.

Absolutely incorrect. I used to think the same thing about SWAPA's contracts. The reality is that they've darn near always had a great contract and great pay. It's just that the thing was so complex (to us based on our ALPA contracts) that many of us didn't understand just how much these guys were bringing home. Smart on their part, lazy on our part to not know and assume the worst.

Yup. Agreed.

You're correct again, but now we have to focus on how to get ourselves out. What's ALPA/DALPA's plan? Absolutely no discussion whatsoever on reversing scope decay, and plenty of discussion as to why management can't afford to "give us" C2K restoration. No release of any survey data, no chance of our opener being released to us after it's exchanged with management, and no chance for a transcript of the meetings on scope with our direct RJ competitors. This is a recipe for disaster when we see the TA.

Carl

Carl Spackler

You're not answering my question. Why did your initial post talk about DPA blaming ALPA for AMR's bankruptcy, then post articles about United's bankruptcy? I'm not trying to pick a fight with you, I just don't understand what your point was.

That's incorrect. Bates liked ALPA for sure, but unlike ALPA, Bates isn't the APA. The APA is a bunch of local councils, and many of them did not like and/or trust ALPA.

It was more than just a little internal shakeup. There were a number of APA local councils that wanted ALPA out, so ALPA quit because they felt they'd been insulted. Bates was able to turn it around and ALPA came back...until bankruptcy when ALPA quit again.

Interesting how you MEC bureaucrats stopped touting ALPA's role in negotiating APA's contract. At first that's all we heard from you. Stuff like: "Even APA realizes that ALPA holds the industry's expertise in negotiations, and have now hired ALPA to manage their negotiations. This is something DPA could never offer...", etc. Then ALPA quits twice, but you guys don't tout that. What a shock!

It's because I don't know that anything DPA has claimed is NOT factual. You keep calling it a lie and crap, but you'll understand if I don't consider your anger and fear based opinion...fact.

Carl

Carl Spackler

Pressure tactics from union and management after a TA is released is a very powerful tool. It shouldn't be, and I wish it wasn't, but it is. I understand management doing it. I've been the recipient of that for 30 years. But getting it from your own union is what is completely unsat.

With regard to uniting and not fighting each other, this attempt at a new union is NOT DISUNITY. If DPA loses, we will all continue to unite around ALPA. In my case it will be painful to do so, but I WILL do it. If DPA wins, I'll bet everyone will do the same except for the current crop of MEC bureaucrats who will have had their lives turned upside down.

I think we need to be careful throwing out the disunity card. It's a recipe for ensuring that our current bargaining agent NEVER changes...no matter how bad their results. I believe in unity behind great results. If the results suck, unify behind a new organization.

Carl

Carl Spackler

Oh cool, thanks for that. I'm so looking forward to page 56 where it will discuss that the average Delta pilot gets 87 hours per month. And how tightly expenses are controlled.

But thanks for reminding me about a "policy manual". With such a tight policy manual that everyone follows to the letter, why on Earth is DALPA so terrified of releasing flight pay loss data??

Carl

TheManager

Ok. Let's look at the facts.

NuGuy asked this in post 7155:

Is it, or is it not, true that schedules less than 70 hours are deleted when considering what is "average" when computing the number to pay FPL people?

That would go a LONG way in explaining why everyone I know is getting 68 hour lines from PBS, yet the "average" pay for FPL purposes is 87 hours.

If true, the real way to make a dent in the FPL pay is to change the policy manual to take into consideration all lines down to 60 hours, versus 70.

Nu


Well, here we have it. Straight from section 10.C.3

3. The MEC treasurer will periodically (but at least annually) determine the average
pay hours for regular line holders (computed average), which shall be approved
by the DAL MEC. This average will be used to determine the computed average
rate for full-time and part-time compensation. At every regularly scheduled MEC
meeting, the MEC treasurer will provide the MEC with the computed average rate

and the methodology used to determine the computed average rate

So, the MEC treasurer determines the "computed average."

What methodology is used by the treasurer to come to the "computed average?" What is the definition of "regular line holder?" Does this exclude those on reserve? In training? Only regular line holders in a short staffed category? Only regular line holders in only the months of June, July and August?

How can the line pilot, or rather DALPA's customers see how this determination and methodology was made by the treasurer? I see that it is made available to the MEC. How about making it available for all pilots to see anytime it is changed.

Point is, the process couldn't be any more opaque or be definition easier to manipulte to get and support any given number.

tsquare

Is there anyway to mark a thread so that it won't ever come up, even if there are "new" posts in it?

DAL 88 Driver

It's a little thing called "discipline." When you see the thread you don't want to see, simply avoid clicking on it and you're good to go!

bigbusdriver

C20 said the FPL report would be published no later than April and each subsequent April for the previous calendar year.

Carl Spackler

IF that actually happens, we'll have to wait and see what is actually in the published report.

Carl