The article says about a 20% chance that AA/US will not go through. And even if bought by one of those carriers it isnt a certainty that we would be operate separately, but it still doesn't give me a warm fuzzy feeling to see in public articles that an acquiring carrier would have to decide if they should integrate us. We have very weak merger language, and no fragmentation language in the PEA, so it could be ugly.

 

JetBlue Pilots don't think it will happen. They seem to "believe" management wouldn't let it happen to them. They simply believe Management are nice guys and really care.

They don't really consider the business side of things. I have to say though, a lot of JetBlue Pilots can fly a kick a$$ ILS.

And, instrument approaches are a big part of what we do. So that's good.


JJ

 

Agreed. Everyone needs to understand that being a nice guy and being a top executive at any organization are completely separate and unrelated issues. Being a nice guy doesn't have any correlation on how the Board of Directors determine the best course of action to increase shareholder value.

The "airline within an airline" concept has been tried and failed many times (remember Ted/United, Song/Delta, etc) so if anyone bought us I can't see a reason for them to operate jetblue separately for any length of time. The only reason to do this would be to slowly siphon off our routes as the acquiring carrier gets new aircraft and hires replacements.

So to integrate? Or not (and siphon flying)?

Lets say AA buys jetblue. We have no contractual obligation to be integrated, so it is purely a financial decision. If jetblue is stapled and everyone is at year 1 pay then it would make sense to integrate. If Barger were to somehow demand we all got DOH for pay purposes then it wouldn't make any sense to put all jetblue pilots through AA indoc/training and pay them higher salaries since they could hire off the street and get a year 1 guy much cheaper.

 

Hilarious watching the wage slaves 'one-up-manship' each other on who can predict how master is going to spend his money......

 

Make no mistake. You are in the same boat Captain Consessionary Contract.

 

We are all slaves in this business, whether we admit it or not. I enjoy trying to follow the industry and learning the nuts and bolts of what is going on. What's so wrong about that? I dont know anything more than you or the next poster on this thread.

 

What's my point? Are you serious? Really? It is a CLEAR example of how increased costs limit our ability to grow. CLEAR. It doesn't matter if it is MX costs, fuel costs, aircraft rental costs, or labor costs. They ALL have to be paid, and the money to pay them is BY DEFINITION, LIMITED and SCARCE!

You can keep laying out words from your Embry Riddle Business Statistics textbook and make bold statements about JB having an unlimited ability to cover increased labor costs without slowing it's growth rate, but your statements are as accurate as Big Foots last known location.

It is almost impossible how stupid you would have to be to say that costs don't matter and won't change our ability to grow. Almost.

The company already slowed growth for the rest of this year over a MX increase of just 31 million dollars. 31 Million, that is LESS money than it would cost to give you the vacation system you want, so that a bunch of senior guys can get more summer vacation.... Changing ONLY our vacation would cost more than 31 million, and that was enough to slow our growth rate! That doesn't include higher pay rates, 321 pay, health insurance, disability, trip and duty rigs, work rules, reserve rule improvements, retirement, bonus plan..........

 

Did you know this?

As Barger increases the revenue stream with first class, JB pilots are left low class with no ability to negotiate a piece of the pie.

Unbelievable......

 

First, it is important to remember that all these guys that are complaining about pay, have attained virtually ALL of THEIR seniority by growth, which was primarily driven by lower costs. They have ALL, since day ONE, worked for a less than "industry standard" package. What they want, is all their cake, and my cake, and to eat it too. They want all the seniority they accumulated by working for less, and now want higher pay, even if it means slower growth for everyone behind them.

So, your question is when. First of all, I want more now. However, I want to be careful how much more and to be mindful of our ability to grow.

We are NOT as profitable as these guys pretend (a record for us is low compared to others). We are small compared to almost everyone, especially now with mega-mergers. We have a lower yielding imature network. We are vulnerable to aquisition. We have entire regions of the country that have NO idea who we are. We have an inept management team that is scared of their own shadow when it comes to growth and competition. We don't have large highly profitable widebody fleets. We don't have anything approaching a well rounded route map for key business travelers. We have a lot of debt. Our stock price is in the chitter. We have the smallest average aircraft guage of any of our competitors.

So yes, I want a more stable, more profitable, more secure JB before I demand pay and benefits in line with 5 of the largest airlines in the world, and one established regional powerhouse mega-profit generator.

Also, one of the problems here at JB is that we have NO retirements for 10-15 years. We do have a retirement bubble, but not until 10-15 years after everyone else. So I would also like for us to be closer to the seniority progression of other companies before we do something that WILL slow growth. That is only fair to the junior pilots here, since the senior guys already milked all the benefits of a growing airline with low labor costs.

It is a tough issue. I am pro-union, but am also concerned about my career here if our growth is slowed. And I will NOT sit silently while blow-hards tell me that labor costs simply don't matter, and that the company has an unlimited ability to pay ANY increase in labor costs, with no adverse consequenses whatsoever.

As much as these guys want to pretend we are, we are NOT Delta, United, AA, SW or even Alaska(have you seen their quarterly profits!?). We just aren't.

 

Wow, you must have a real need to feel superior to others and to show them you are the big man.

We will have 11 aircraft with a first class. Eleven. Wow.... In addition, the aircraft will have 31 fewer seats, so it remains entirely to be seen if they actually NET more money or not.

Either way, you are a complete Jack-A@@ with your tone toward us. We are NOT the 2nd largest airline in the world. We do not have a worldwide fleet of widebody aircraft subsidizing our pay and benefits. We have not been around for 80 years, and we certainly did NOT make 500 million in profit in July alone.

We are working on unionizing, but it says more about you than us that you feel you need to demean us in this way.