Getting hired with no turbine experience.
02-13-2007 | 05:12 AM
#51
Living the dream!
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 915
Likes: 0
From: MD-11 Capt
I appreciate your opinion and the well delivered message. You need to understand that there have been many highly qualified minority applicants who have been overlooked in favor of applicant's who were, in fact hired solely based on race. Not good for any of US. Don't ever assume that being a minority is somehow easier than being a WASP male. That in itself is ridiculous. And be appreciative of what you have. I admit that it bothered me a little bit when Vanilla Ice won the Grammy for best rap album, but not enough for me to stop listening to the music. If you in fact believe that all pilots should meet the minimums, I support you 100%. Do something about it, or feel sorry for the "poor white man." Just don't tell me how easy I've had it, and I'll do the same for you.
Never said anyone had it easy in this profession. One of the best Captains I've ever flown with was a black man at FedEx. On the flip side the worst HANDS down was a black man (skills and attitude) at FedEx. There are great and terrible pilots of every race and gender.
For any pilot, if you have to tell everyone you are a good pilot then you probably are not. Good guys rise to the top without ever opening their mouths. Both guys I mentioned their reputations preceeded them and in both cases I knew what I was in for.
Do a good job and it shouldn't matter about the rest.
Last edited by R1200RT; 02-13-2007 at 08:30 AM.
02-13-2007 | 05:49 AM
#52
Banned
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,929
Likes: 0
From: A-320
I appreciate your opinion and the well delivered message. You need to understand that there have been many highly qualified minority applicants who have been overlooked in favor of applicant's who were, in fact hired solely based on race. Not good for any of US. Don't ever assume that being a minority is somehow easier than being a WASP male. That in itself is ridiculous. And be appreciative of what you have. I admit that it bothered me a little bit when Vanilla Ice won the Grammy for best rap album, but not enough for me to stop listening to the music. If you in fact believe that all pilots should meet the minimums, I support you 100%. Do something about it, or feel sorry for the "poor white man." Just don't tell me how easy I've had it, and I'll do the same for you.
02-13-2007 | 08:01 AM
#53
Ben Salley
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 924
Likes: 0
From: Left
You know this kinda sounds alot like Bush calling OBOMA, "Articulate" That just threw everybody into a rage, it was a compliment for christsake, maybe the people you flew with where curious as to where you got your experience!!!!!!!!!!!! I get asked all the time, wow how where you able to fly at such a young age, etc........... If I was African American would that?should that offend me? I dunno Its hard to say on my end becuase I am a white male, not to go on a rant, but my best friend, whom is Puerto Rican, whom we grew up together came form the same middle class family, etc... well I had better grades, and a higher SAT score, he got into RUTGERS COLLEGE I however did not,??? Is that fair??????????
Last edited by A320fumes; 02-13-2007 at 08:08 AM.
02-13-2007 | 08:56 AM
#54
Banned
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,929
Likes: 0
From: A-320
I got my undergrad at Rutgers.Excellent education. Great Diversity program. I took some latino studies classes that enhanced my experiences during my travels in Latin America and the Iberian. Go Scarlet Knights! My GPA and SAT's were pretty high. Certainly high enough to warrant unassisted matriculation, but they were happy to enroll me under low-income, urban-youth and veteran status.
02-13-2007 | 10:04 AM
#56
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 849
Likes: 0
From: Student Pilot
I think it's safe to make this sweeping generalization that most minority pilots (female/black/Mexican/one-armed/etc.) neither want nor expect preferential treatment. They probably just want to be seen as what they are - pilots. If mgmt does give preferential treatment, what are they gonna do... change their names on the resume?
Obviously everyone knows this one black dude who got hired below mins or some female who had less time than all the others in the interviewing group. The problem seems like people then apply this exception they know to the minority group as whole.. i.e., whenever you see some young blonde female pilot, you automatically assume that she got hired below mins and thus stole the job that should've been yours. Maybe she did... but for many more young blonde females who plugged their way through like everyone else, these assumptions undermine the qualifications they worked hard (like everyone else) to achieve.
I think it's also safe to say that most of the preferential hiring is done through connections/internal recs., not minority hiring. I can't count how many times the corporate/fractional pilots I've met in FBOs tell me to make as much connections as I can because that's how they got in with their companies. One guy can have less time or qualifications than another dude, but still get in with the company because he knows the owner, or his dad is best buddies with the chief pilot, etc. etc. Yet, there's no shame in saying one got a job because of connections, and no outcry about that from other pilots. It might be unfair, but it's just a fact of life.
Besides, whoever said that the more hours you have the more qualified you are? Obviously there's a difference between someone with 500 hrs and someone with 3000 hrs. But once you cross a certain mark, it all just comes down to attitude.
that's my story and im stickin to it!
Obviously everyone knows this one black dude who got hired below mins or some female who had less time than all the others in the interviewing group. The problem seems like people then apply this exception they know to the minority group as whole.. i.e., whenever you see some young blonde female pilot, you automatically assume that she got hired below mins and thus stole the job that should've been yours. Maybe she did... but for many more young blonde females who plugged their way through like everyone else, these assumptions undermine the qualifications they worked hard (like everyone else) to achieve.
I think it's also safe to say that most of the preferential hiring is done through connections/internal recs., not minority hiring. I can't count how many times the corporate/fractional pilots I've met in FBOs tell me to make as much connections as I can because that's how they got in with their companies. One guy can have less time or qualifications than another dude, but still get in with the company because he knows the owner, or his dad is best buddies with the chief pilot, etc. etc. Yet, there's no shame in saying one got a job because of connections, and no outcry about that from other pilots. It might be unfair, but it's just a fact of life.
Besides, whoever said that the more hours you have the more qualified you are? Obviously there's a difference between someone with 500 hrs and someone with 3000 hrs. But once you cross a certain mark, it all just comes down to attitude.
that's my story and im stickin to it!
02-13-2007 | 10:25 AM
#57
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 500
Likes: 0
From: 737 F/O
I think it's safe to make this sweeping generalization that most minority pilots (female/black/Mexican/one-armed/etc.) neither want nor expect preferential treatment. They probably just want to be seen as what they are - pilots. If mgmt does give preferential treatment, what are they gonna do... change their names on the resume?
Obviously everyone knows this one black dude who got hired below mins or some female who had less time than all the others in the interviewing group. The problem seems like people then apply this exception they know to the minority group as whole.. i.e., whenever you see some young blonde female pilot, you automatically assume that she got hired below mins and thus stole the job that should've been yours. Maybe she did... but for many more young blonde females who plugged their way through like everyone else, these assumptions undermine the qualifications they worked hard (like everyone else) to achieve.
I think it's also safe to say that most of the preferential hiring is done through connections/internal recs., not minority hiring. I can't count how many times the corporate/fractional pilots I've met in FBOs tell me to make as much connections as I can because that's how they got in with their companies. One guy can have less time or qualifications than another dude, but still get in with the company because he knows the owner, or his dad is best buddies with the chief pilot, etc. etc. Yet, there's no shame in saying one got a job because of connections, and no outcry about that from other pilots. It might be unfair, but it's just a fact of life.
Besides, whoever said that the more hours you have the more qualified you are? Obviously there's a difference between someone with 500 hrs and someone with 3000 hrs. But once you cross a certain mark, it all just comes down to attitude.
that's my story and im stickin to it!
Obviously everyone knows this one black dude who got hired below mins or some female who had less time than all the others in the interviewing group. The problem seems like people then apply this exception they know to the minority group as whole.. i.e., whenever you see some young blonde female pilot, you automatically assume that she got hired below mins and thus stole the job that should've been yours. Maybe she did... but for many more young blonde females who plugged their way through like everyone else, these assumptions undermine the qualifications they worked hard (like everyone else) to achieve.
I think it's also safe to say that most of the preferential hiring is done through connections/internal recs., not minority hiring. I can't count how many times the corporate/fractional pilots I've met in FBOs tell me to make as much connections as I can because that's how they got in with their companies. One guy can have less time or qualifications than another dude, but still get in with the company because he knows the owner, or his dad is best buddies with the chief pilot, etc. etc. Yet, there's no shame in saying one got a job because of connections, and no outcry about that from other pilots. It might be unfair, but it's just a fact of life.
Besides, whoever said that the more hours you have the more qualified you are? Obviously there's a difference between someone with 500 hrs and someone with 3000 hrs. But once you cross a certain mark, it all just comes down to attitude.
that's my story and im stickin to it!
02-13-2007 | 10:28 AM
#58
Freightmama!
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,880
Likes: 0
From: 757/767 FO
Exactly.
kalyx522, you hit the nail on the head with your post.
02-13-2007 | 12:46 PM
#59
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
Not no but hell no. Good luck.
02-13-2007 | 02:13 PM
#60
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 423
Likes: 0
I think it's safe to make this sweeping generalization that most minority pilots (female/black/Mexican/one-armed/etc.) neither want nor expect preferential treatment. They probably just want to be seen as what they are - pilots. If mgmt does give preferential treatment, what are they gonna do... change their names on the resume?
Obviously everyone knows this one black dude who got hired below mins or some female who had less time than all the others in the interviewing group. The problem seems like people then apply this exception they know to the minority group as whole.. i.e., whenever you see some young blonde female pilot, you automatically assume that she got hired below mins and thus stole the job that should've been yours. Maybe she did... but for many more young blonde females who plugged their way through like everyone else, these assumptions undermine the qualifications they worked hard (like everyone else) to achieve.
I think it's also safe to say that most of the preferential hiring is done through connections/internal recs., not minority hiring. I can't count how many times the corporate/fractional pilots I've met in FBOs tell me to make as much connections as I can because that's how they got in with their companies. One guy can have less time or qualifications than another dude, but still get in with the company because he knows the owner, or his dad is best buddies with the chief pilot, etc. etc. Yet, there's no shame in saying one got a job because of connections, and no outcry about that from other pilots. It might be unfair, but it's just a fact of life.
Besides, whoever said that the more hours you have the more qualified you are? Obviously there's a difference between someone with 500 hrs and someone with 3000 hrs. But once you cross a certain mark, it all just comes down to attitude.
that's my story and im stickin to it!
Obviously everyone knows this one black dude who got hired below mins or some female who had less time than all the others in the interviewing group. The problem seems like people then apply this exception they know to the minority group as whole.. i.e., whenever you see some young blonde female pilot, you automatically assume that she got hired below mins and thus stole the job that should've been yours. Maybe she did... but for many more young blonde females who plugged their way through like everyone else, these assumptions undermine the qualifications they worked hard (like everyone else) to achieve.
I think it's also safe to say that most of the preferential hiring is done through connections/internal recs., not minority hiring. I can't count how many times the corporate/fractional pilots I've met in FBOs tell me to make as much connections as I can because that's how they got in with their companies. One guy can have less time or qualifications than another dude, but still get in with the company because he knows the owner, or his dad is best buddies with the chief pilot, etc. etc. Yet, there's no shame in saying one got a job because of connections, and no outcry about that from other pilots. It might be unfair, but it's just a fact of life.
Besides, whoever said that the more hours you have the more qualified you are? Obviously there's a difference between someone with 500 hrs and someone with 3000 hrs. But once you cross a certain mark, it all just comes down to attitude.
that's my story and im stickin to it!
Tom
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
pdavis4
Flight Schools and Training
8
10-12-2006 01:33 PM
Bengalsfan
Major
21
01-26-2006 05:00 AM
