Netjets latest & greatest:
04-02-2015, 12:11 PM
#781
Line Holder
Joined APC: Dec 2008
Posts: 33
Originally Posted by Jetlife
Guys I know I just got hired. Of course you guys know more than I do on the ins and outs. But there seems to be a common focus from a certain group of pilots at NJA that paint the worst case scenario picture for everyone around them. Whether it be in the FBO or online. Saying that people aren't moving airplanes at all, period, would be false based on whom I have talked to doing initials . To say that nobody is upgrading is false based on a bid being issued. Does that mean everyone is swapping fleets and upgrading? Hell no! Of course it does nothing for the 9 year FO who is still waiting, it's 2 spots in a sea of willing and able FOs ready to upgrade. But can't anyone see ANY positivity in the way things are going? NetJets has recalled, they are hiring... These are good things people. I get that there is a lot of frustration but why take everything as glass half empty around here?
I am starting to get the feeling that pay isn't going to fix everyone's gripes with the company, so why stick around? Money won't fix upgrades or fleet swapping... It will only make things worse in those aspects.
I can only say that I hope new hires placed into aircraft that you guys wan't, aren't treated differently for it. We are all here to fight the fight with you, not against you. My post wasn't to cause crap, and I don't know more than you guys who have been around I promise you I understand that. I just go by who I have talked to, and the emails I have seen. To say any absolutes is false and incorrect in my opinion.
I am starting to get the feeling that pay isn't going to fix everyone's gripes with the company, so why stick around? Money won't fix upgrades or fleet swapping... It will only make things worse in those aspects.
I can only say that I hope new hires placed into aircraft that you guys wan't, aren't treated differently for it. We are all here to fight the fight with you, not against you. My post wasn't to cause crap, and I don't know more than you guys who have been around I promise you I understand that. I just go by who I have talked to, and the emails I have seen. To say any absolutes is false and incorrect in my opinion.
Then, at the bottom of the list and look at all the DA-2000 new SIC's. Mad at them, no. Mad at mis-management yes. It just means my expected level of compensation will rise in our new contract on par with our 121 Legacy peers.
04-02-2015, 12:42 PM
#782
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Narrow/Left Wide/Right
Posts: 3,655
Originally Posted by Jetlife
Guys I know I just got hired. Of course you guys know more than I do on the ins and outs. But there seems to be a common focus from a certain group of pilots at NJA that paint the worst case scenario picture for everyone around them. Whether it be in the FBO or online. Saying that people aren't moving airplanes at all, period, would be false based on whom I have talked to doing initials . To say that nobody is upgrading is false based on a bid being issued. Does that mean everyone is swapping fleets and upgrading? Hell no! Of course it does nothing for the 9 year FO who is still waiting, it's 2 spots in a sea of willing and able FOs ready to upgrade. But can't anyone see ANY positivity in the way things are going? NetJets has recalled, they are hiring... These are good things people. I get that there is a lot of frustration but why take everything as glass half empty around here?
I am starting to get the feeling that pay isn't going to fix everyone's gripes with the company, so why stick around? Money won't fix upgrades or fleet swapping... It will only make things worse in those aspects.
I can only say that I hope new hires placed into aircraft that you guys wan't, aren't treated differently for it. We are all here to fight the fight with you, not against you. My post wasn't to cause crap, and I don't know more than you guys who have been around I promise you I understand that. I just go by who I have talked to, and the emails I have seen. To say any absolutes is false and incorrect in my opinion.
I am starting to get the feeling that pay isn't going to fix everyone's gripes with the company, so why stick around? Money won't fix upgrades or fleet swapping... It will only make things worse in those aspects.
I can only say that I hope new hires placed into aircraft that you guys wan't, aren't treated differently for it. We are all here to fight the fight with you, not against you. My post wasn't to cause crap, and I don't know more than you guys who have been around I promise you I understand that. I just go by who I have talked to, and the emails I have seen. To say any absolutes is false and incorrect in my opinion.
I applaud your unbridled optimism, but heed those who have come before you that you will be served well to keep your options/and mind open to other opportunities.
When you have senior pilots telling you it's not good, that's not good. Usually the junior complain and the senior tell them to ****. In this case the opposite is going on.
04-02-2015, 12:51 PM
#783
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Narrow/Left Wide/Right
Posts: 3,655
Originally Posted by Macjet
And I think our fan boys are deceiving only themselves. If we get to arbitration they're going to compare our pay and work rules to XO Jet, Flex, Shares, and Executive and not UA, AA, WN, or DL. I've got a better chance at a threesome with Angelina and Jennifer than we do at WN+1%. Worth has nothing to do with it and unfortunately we are far above our peers already. Our industry has historically paid based upon size as our current contract does and we're gong to be compared to like size operators. The reality is that we're already the best paid fractional pilots in the world and it'll be hard to point at guys driving equipment that carry more in fuel then we weight and demand their pay. I wish it could be but I just don't see it happening.
Better get the details in writing or it will be Rosanna Barr and Honey Boo Boo's mom.
04-02-2015, 01:53 PM
#784
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: CA
Posts: 109
Originally Posted by frmrdashtrash
Jet, a PIC bid at Netjets does not mean an upgrade. At some point that will change, but for the moment those new PIC bids will be awarded to someone who is already a captain.
These two bids will go to very senior pilots who are already PIC's, especially since the 2000EX is over 40,000# MGTOW therefore paying more. I'm not sure who you are speaking to, but there have not been any "true" SIC to PIC upgrades in over 7 years. The last Phenom PIC bid had a GV SIC awarded the bid, but he was a PIC who bid Gulfstream SIC for the type-rating, and then back to PIC to get back on the PIC payscale. Like we are all telling you Jetlife, just sit back and watch for a while, you will see what we are talking about.
04-02-2015, 02:17 PM
#785
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Position: A330 FO
Posts: 273
Originally Posted by eglplt
^^^^^^This!!
These two bids will go to very senior pilots who are already PIC's, especially since the 2000EX is over 40,000# MGTOW therefore paying more. I'm not sure who you are speaking to, but there have not been any "true" SIC to PIC upgrades in over 7 years. The last Phenom PIC bid had a GV SIC awarded the bid, but he was a PIC who bid Gulfstream SIC for the type-rating, and then back to PIC to get back on the PIC payscale. Like we are all telling you Jetlife, just sit back and watch for a while, you will see what we are talking about.
These two bids will go to very senior pilots who are already PIC's, especially since the 2000EX is over 40,000# MGTOW therefore paying more. I'm not sure who you are speaking to, but there have not been any "true" SIC to PIC upgrades in over 7 years. The last Phenom PIC bid had a GV SIC awarded the bid, but he was a PIC who bid Gulfstream SIC for the type-rating, and then back to PIC to get back on the PIC payscale. Like we are all telling you Jetlife, just sit back and watch for a while, you will see what we are talking about.
04-02-2015, 02:18 PM
#786
Banned
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: 7th green
Posts: 4,378
Originally Posted by jaybird
Then, at the bottom of the list and look at all the DA-2000 new SIC's. Mad at them, no. Mad at mis-management yes. It just means my expected level of compensation will rise in our new contract on par with our 121 Legacy peers.
If, in fact, new hires are getting DA2000 SIC seats are they already typed and/or qualified in similar sized/mission aircraft? It appears that's what you guys are insinuating.
04-02-2015, 03:43 PM
#787
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 357
Or you could quit listening to people and make your own judgments. There is a VERY vocal yet small group. The board is filled with angry people who will not be satisfied when we get a pay raise...they just like to *****.
I know plenty of senior pilots who remain positive about the future.
I know plenty of senior pilots who remain positive about the future.
Originally Posted by full of luv
Jet,
I applaud your unbridled optimism, but heed those who have come before you that you will be served well to keep your options/and mind open to other opportunities.
When you have senior pilots telling you it's not good, that's not good. Usually the junior complain and the senior tell them to ****. In this case the opposite is going on.
I applaud your unbridled optimism, but heed those who have come before you that you will be served well to keep your options/and mind open to other opportunities.
When you have senior pilots telling you it's not good, that's not good. Usually the junior complain and the senior tell them to ****. In this case the opposite is going on.
04-02-2015, 08:16 PM
#788
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: If its got wings I'll fly it
Posts: 118
Originally Posted by Packrat
I'm wondering if NJ hires according to aircraft size needs, i.e. if they need large, intercontinental jet seats filled they do so with candidates with that type experience. Likewise, if they need Phenom pilots they go for younger, less experienced pilots.
If, in fact, new hires are getting DA2000 SIC seats are they already typed and/or qualified in similar sized/mission aircraft? It appears that's what you guys are insinuating.
If, in fact, new hires are getting DA2000 SIC seats are they already typed and/or qualified in similar sized/mission aircraft? It appears that's what you guys are insinuating.
04-03-2015, 03:05 AM
#789
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2014
Posts: 121
Disclaimer: I am not a Netjets pilot but I stayed at a Hotel Inn Express last night.
If I was a CPT at Netjets I would also be positive about the future. You have 2 pilot groups there: CPT's who are making decent money and arent going anywhere and FO's who wont make 100K ever and are pretty much all looking to leave.
I hope your contract fixes that.
Netjets experienced a lot of growth in the early 2000's which resulted in a young pilot demographic. Those pilot's are now CPT's in their mid 40's making good money, they arent leaving for 20 years. I know I wouldnt.
If I was a CPT at Netjets I would also be positive about the future. You have 2 pilot groups there: CPT's who are making decent money and arent going anywhere and FO's who wont make 100K ever and are pretty much all looking to leave.
I hope your contract fixes that.
Netjets experienced a lot of growth in the early 2000's which resulted in a young pilot demographic. Those pilot's are now CPT's in their mid 40's making good money, they arent leaving for 20 years. I know I wouldnt.
04-04-2015, 06:10 AM
#790
Lax 320 fo
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Position: Fifi Fo
Posts: 59
How many new hires have gone to the Falcon 2000?
Originally Posted by Packrat
I'm wondering if NJ hires according to aircraft size needs, i.e. if they need large, intercontinental jet seats filled they do so with candidates with that type experience. Likewise, if they need Phenom pilots they go for younger, less experienced pilots.
If, in fact, new hires are getting DA2000 SIC seats are they already typed and/or qualified in similar sized/mission aircraft? It appears that's what you guys are insinuating.
If, in fact, new hires are getting DA2000 SIC seats are they already typed and/or qualified in similar sized/mission aircraft? It appears that's what you guys are insinuating.
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