Originally Posted by bretthull

pretty sure its in seniority order.

Originally Posted by MEMbrain

Talk about entitlement.... regional pilots thinking the DESERVE guaranteed mainline jobs. What about the REAL group of pilots who
DESERVE to go directly to mainline.... military pilots?

Originally Posted by MrMustache

Right but theoretically an FO could interview? Nothing says they HAVE to be a CA?

Originally Posted by QuagmireGiggity

I work for AMR corporation. There have been union agreements in place for AA pilots to come work here at Eagle which cost me financial harm. A fair agreement in my eyes because a part of the agreement is that I go to AA at some point. Things are not always as they seem... so I forgive your ignorance on the subject. So yes I believe I am entitled to something agreed upon more than 17 years ago. I work for the same company.. do you not understand that? Why would a pilot from the outside have priority?
The entire regional industry needs to dissolve.

Originally Posted by What

Ok, lets get some things straight.

The last MEC leadership at AE was working with management, we tried to remove them on multiple occasions but ALPA national was always there to help or side step recalls. Our MEC did offer an apprentice scale that later was labeled a B scale as it should have, just as the "new scale" at PSA. Because we were able to replace one of our local elected reps and much pressure from the pilot group the proposal never made it to the pilots. Yes, the B scale conversation was started at AE, and was brought to the table my the union reps with backing from ALPA national.

When our reps voted down the offer, and not all voted it down as 2 felt that the pilot group should be the ones to decide even after we expressed that it should be killed at the table. They came talking to PSA within hours, the same will happen when you are done voting. If you guys vote yes they will go talk to Mesa with your current TA and say they have to beat it to be cost effective and gain flying. If you vote NO they will go to Mesa and say that they have to agree to concessions in order to gain flying.

This is why they call it a race to the bottom, they will go airline to airline with proposals, if one agrees to concessions the next one will have to start from where the previous airline did and beat it. Since management conducts concessions negotiations very fast paces and threatens to go to the next airline it's a race to the bottom as in who accepts the lower wages the fastest to "gain" flying. You have said that they will talk to Mesa next if you vote it down, and you are alluding that you have to pass this so Mesa doesn't get the airplanes. In other words you are saying you have to underbid Mesa!

One regional already said no, the leadership tried an "apprentice scale" and it backfired just like most things they have done in the last few years. But the pressure is on PSA to vote accordingly. People have different reasons for voting YES/NO but what I ask is not to vote out of fear that management will just take the airplanes elsewhere as they can't even staff the current flying and the majors are not doing much hiring but everyone's flood gates will open this fall. Right now there is huge demand for pilots in the US and we do it cheaper than anyone in the world so they won't be bringing in replacements from overseas. We are the outsourced workers and we work against each other.

Eagle just had vacancy bid with upgrades, they backfilled Chicago CRJ CA positions, just two months ago they did displacements but have pushed the dates as RAH doesn't have the staffing to fly all the Ejets promised to AA. In other words they allowed pilots to bid back into a position that they initially had cut because the other regionals can't cover the flying.

Read the SCOPE clauses for all the majors, every regional will shrink in the next 2 years by 30% on average. Some will shrink less and some will shrink more but on average there are 300-400 RJs heading to the desert. SKW INC will park 250+, AE will park 100 or so, RAH will likely park most ERJ. You need to ask your self, with the demand in air travel rising and SCOPE tightening because of economic reasons, pilot leverage and lack of pilots will I sell my self short for a possible interview and a guarantee of 30 airplanes with no answer for the ones I currently fly.

You mentioned that Obama care is a huge mystery right now, one thing is certain and that is the employer cost will go up. Since pilots are full time employees and there is a lack of us, the airline will have to pay for the burden of full time employees but with this TA you will share close to 40% of the burden, meaning your W2 just got a whole lot smaller.

Vote as you wish, Eagle pilots that come here thumping on their chest have nothing to brag about as during BK we didn't even allow the company to file an 1113 since our union raced to collaborate with management and our pilot group passed the TA with super majority instead of seeing it thru. With that in mind, look at where we are.

Parked a fleet, parking more airplanes, closed two bases and four domiciles, gained a co-domicile, outsourced flying in three out five bases shrinking a base by 50% and we gave them what they asked for that includes a longevity adjustment in 2016 to the bottom 2 regionals. Meanwhile they came back for another bite at the apple and we still don't have a fleet plan two years after filling BK. Many around here learned from their mistakes, other have to learn from their mistakes as well.

Last year many of us were looked as the vocal minority, the management haters, the rebels. Today we are looked at the ones that understood what was going on and didn't drink the cool aid from management or ALPA. Don't fall for the trap, currently Mesa pilots are trying to get a raise, voting this TA in will only grow the small percentage of regionals with 12 year pay scales and 37 bucks an hr FO.

Originally Posted by MrMustache

Right but theoretically an FO could interview? Nothing says they HAVE to be a CA?

Originally Posted by frmrdashtrash

No dog in the fight either, but you would have to painfully stupid to vote this trash in. It's not even worth wiping with.

Meyers, you worry me. Anytime one part of a pilot group is working under a different set of rules or compensation than another part of the same group, it's a B scale. We had it an NJA. I drove past a perfectly good airport to get to my crew base. More than once I flew with a guy who lived 2 or 3 miles from my house. He flew out of the airport 15 miles from where we both lived, I drove 90 to get to my base. On day 7, he's done mowing his yard and into his second beer before I hit the city limits. Two pilots, one CBA, different work rules. That's a B scale, and it doesn't take a rocket surgeon to figure this out....

Originally Posted by PeopleMover90

Interviews would be in seniority order regardless of seat. Only requirement is being here for 12 months.

The current LOA is that you have to have been in your seat for 12 months, FO or capt. So upgrade and you incur a 12 month seat lock before you go to mainline. That has been removed in the new LOA, and they have to take 4/mo or if PSA hold you back due to staffing mainline still has to take 48 in the year, in seniority order after interviews. So they could interview 15 to find the 4 they like, etc. reach the bottom and they start going through the list again. Theoretically as I understand it if PSA holds pilots back due to staffing they could only do so for a few months cause otherwise at the end of the year they'd lose 48 in a month. Correct me if I'm wrong. The 4/mo is if PSA approves, but 48 a year is guaranteed.

One (of many) answers I can't find is how do you bypass? It says all pilots have to apply by dec or 10 months from DOH. Otherwise it's considered turning down the offer and pay freezes then. So how does an 10 year captain for example bypass interview but continue to year 12 pay?

Originally Posted by fullflank

You can't bypass thats the issue. Your number comes up, you better go interview , otherwise youre frozen at current pay. The best part is after you fail two interviews your pay is frozen too. this is great! All they have to do is interview 20 per month, keep shutting us down, and in a few years the entire list is topped out at year 2-5. Haha brilliant. Then the growth you think you're getting will turn into relative seniority loss when the PDT guys come over and the dashes get replaced with these 900s. Date of hire baby! We all slide backwards and with a bscale, topped out at year 8ish.

Originally Posted by PeopleMover90

Worse thing is all of that is plausible.