And you're wrong again. We get 50%.
Go look at what they actually did. They street hired 32. 50% would be 16... We've sent 73 (to that date). There is NO requirement for that is there smart guy?
I'm not making promises either. I've said what their plan is and shown how it can work. People here are capable of reading contracts and deciding for themselves without the lies from a troll like you.

 

Eaglefly has made it abundantly clear that the intent of his troll posts is to see the destruction of regionals (specifically envoy) under the guise of educating new-hires. Scope 2020 right eaglyfly? You have to start your mission somewhere, so why not AA's largest feed operator?

 

Overusing and misapplying the term "troll", doesn't change the fact you're misrepresenting the situation at Envoy. Yes, the company is required to flow Envoy pilots as per the 824 award. Yes, Envoy is presently overstaffed, so they are doing just that and maximizing that to clean overpaid senior pilots OUT. Yes, they are doing this for THEIR benefit, not altruistic love towards the pilots, Yes, YOU are spinning these realities into snake oil to produce the appearance new-hires should flock to Envoy first, Yes, you are trying to convince junior pilots to stay and pass up other jobs, including regionals ostensibly because 121 PIC is now meaningless with Envoy guaranteed 2-6 year trip to AA, Yes, Envoy is going to shrink, No, Envoy isn't hiring many or enough pilots to support your sales pitch and no, just because I don't buy your crap, means I'm a "troll".

Once the 824 are gone (including you), the remainder of Envoy pilots don't have as much flow protection as their agreement was a negotiated settlement and contractually is much more easily altered by AAG.

BTW, I heard your MEC chairman is going to announce a his position on going forward that will require the pilots to be more flexible in their thinking toward management needs and become more collaborative in their interaction. Sounds like your New York pal, the past MEC chairman to me.

Do you guys still get together for drinks and laughs ?

 

Another misapplication of that term "troll", but I understand why you keep using it.

Obviously, you are blinded by your rage against me into abject cluelessness. Hey genius, any mainline pilot who would give up scope is someone who is not trying to destroy regionals, but actually the opposite, so your claim is beyond stupid because it's backward in logic. Looser scope means regionals get more or larger aircraft, not less or smaller. That label is on regard to my belief in what the majority of AA pilots will give in the future for Delta rates as we have nothing else left that hasn't been given away (which is bad for a very junior AA Cujo down the road). Thanks for proving my assertions as clearly some of you clowns are more than willing to twist anything around to meet your needs or suit your interests as I think it's important for new aspiring pilots to see the truth about the mirage Envoy now is because of your self-serving B.S.
My advice is to be more realistic about Envoy and what's happening there so I wouldn't have to enrage you by providing a more realistic POV myself.

 

Nobody wants any more scope relaxation, but the way you are promoting it is through the destruction of envoy, a company you once worked for.

I'm calling BS on your advise because you consistently provide false information in regards to our contract and arbitrated agreements/awards. I've got news for you, if we didn't have the flow, envoy would have folded long ago. Fortunately, we do have a path to mainline, a path which you took yet somehow believe it to be a mythical carrot for anyone else.

The only reason why I can see why you are trying to keep people from coming to envoy is because you are bitter at your former employer and will do everything in your power (over the internet of course) to paint it in a bad light.

I don't care if someone comes here one way or another, because it's not for everyone. However, if you live in commuting distance to either Dallas or Chicago and want to fly for one of the big 3 then it's a very good option. You still fail to see that and think that 1000 TPIC after 2-3 years at a regional is a guaranteed ticket to the legacies.

Which brings me to another question...obviously you exercised your option to flow at some point, so why didn't you go to AA, Delta, United, FedEx, or UPS when you reached that 1000 TPIC milestone?

 

The belief that present and future Envoy pilots should have a more realistic view of Envoy's future as opposed to believing "projections" based on the most optimistic assumptions and falling for CLEAR sales pitches and implied promises by questionable characters with dubious motives equates to "destroying" Envoy ?

Only someone of the exact description above would believe that.

I'M providing false information ?

The "Protected Pilot Agreement" (the flow for the majority of current Envoy pilots and ALL future ones) is bulletproof ?

Please.

Hey, call as much B.S. as you want as that's your right, but I plan to call an equal amount of B.S on yours, others and especially Cujo's fluffed up claims. Yes, at present there IS a "path" to mainline and I've never disputed that. What I have disputed is the guarantee that the future flow at Envoy will assure anyone of anything and I should know. MY flow was promised and "projected" at 2 years and took over a decade and that flow was FAR more "bulletproof" then the PPA and you know what ?

Even with that, some tried to nullify it at the last minute. In fact, for perhaps 150 pilots or so, they did !

Well, I can see why your beliefs about my motivations are so far out of whack. You're clearly in the throes of rage. I don't want to keep people from coming to Envoy and I have posted that in the past here (but those foaming at the jowls with rage don't remember those things). In the past, I have said that if a pilot wants to go to Envoy (or any other regional), it should be for the RIGHT reasons like reputation, stability, treatment, advancement and domicile, NOT projections and hypotheticals that can (and HAVE) been diluted or disappeared in the past.

I paint Envoy ACCURATELY and with no "spin" exactly BECAUSE I have no motivations. You (and others) on the other hand DO want spin because you have motivations (your own greased ride). AFAIC, what's occurring now in regard to this at Envoy by certain pilots there is essentially a Pyramid scheme whose success for the top tiers depends on the successful attraction of pilots willing to become a lower tier for them and so on.......Hey, if a pilot is willing to sign on at Envoy for projections and hypotheticals and risk that, fine, but they should have that knowledge and accept that risk knowing that.

I agree if a pilot WANTS to fly for Envoy for specific reasons, they should apply, but those reasons should be tangible, not assumptive or hypothetical.....at least unless they choose to do so knowing and accepting the risks. BTW, exactly what is "commuting distance" to those hubs ? That would seem to be just about anywhere and the desire to "commute" doesn't seem like something high on anyone's list of regionals. 121 turbine PIC (whatever amount) is something TANGIBLE a pilot can market themselves with as opposed to a flow-through that may or may not materialize at any given point in the future. Is it a guearantee of anything ?

Of course not, but unlike the claims of you or others regarding Envoy's flow, I'm not representing that as such, only noting that it IS something tangible and has value vs. some projection by another company. If a presently potential Envoy pilot goes to interview in the future elsewhere should the "projection" of Envoy's flow not materialize for many such new-hire junior Envoy pilots, will their interviewers care if that applicant has a flow-through promise to AA ?

No, THAT has no value. They WILL care that the applicant has 121 PIC experience, though. Especially one of the "big 3".

Because at that point in the history of the industry (something which you REALLY need to research my friend to avoid galactic disappointment in the future), there WERE no major airline positions to even interview for. They all had pilots on furlough, BUT I was making captains pay at a regional when the "music stopped" and that music has stopped for various reason multiple times in the last 15-20 years. If the music stops in the future, would a pilot best pe served by an uncashed promise or tangible things like 121 PIC time and regionals captains pay ? I think you really need to come down from whatever fantasy utopia Envoy management and their union spin-masters have blown into your pumpkin and become a better student of the history of this profession.

The lollipop's they keep offering and you keep licking will eventually run out. The history of this industry and profession, not to mention the history of Eagle/Envoy PROVES that without question.

 

Looks like Thrustlever is at it again.

 

You keep saying this, but I have yet to figure out any point.

Oh snap, I just figured it out..........there IS no point ! At least some of the Envoy guys HAVE a point, whereas you just seem to have mom's dark, lonely basement, pointless statements of nothingness coupled to endless trysts with Chester Cheetah (and orange fingers to go with it) and a GV Microsoft program that I guess isn't as much fun as it used to be.

 

Funny how you keep bringing the 'mom' reference. Were you abused as a child?

 

No, but in all seriousness, it is interesting you erroneously considered that because one who was abused in early life in some form tends to lie a lot and create fantasies in order to feel better about themselves and help block out confronting previous abuse. I believe psychiatrists refer to that as an emotional "fight or flight" response and in many cases such as your apparent situation, "flight" is chosen and considering your history at Envoy as a pilot, isn't that ironic ?

I've often wondered why you felt is was necessary to create this façade of you being hired as a GV captain from Envoy and boasting about your $250,000 annual corporate new-hire compensation. I just assumed that since you were exposed (actually you admitted it) as someone more then happy to throw fellow Envoy pilots under the bus if it benefitted you, you needed to create a different angle in an attempt to achieve legitimacy, but now I think it may be something far more tragic.

The first step in true recovery is reaching out to professionals and confronting the past. Godspeed, my wounded child.