First one correction; There is no agreement that gives Eagle pilots hired prior to 10/11 "flow-up" rights to AA. 253 do and another 850 or so MIGHT and the bottom 2000 have nothing.

Yes, it sounds like a mess. Considering AA and U will almost certainly merge, this stockyard airline will have to somehow figure a way to compete in the future with hopelessly damaged service providers.

Whoever inherits that job will have to be a flawless magician and I don't think he will be. Of the 3 future "mega-carriers", my bet says as AA/U is the last to exit BK, it will be the first to re-enter it within 5 years.

 

My own edit, since the edit function wasn't available;

How on God’s green earth will all these groups, with valid, time fought positions, combine to produce a united pilot group working together in harmony ensuring an efficient operation? There will be more fences than a Chicago stockyard.

Continue...

 

So where do these Eagle Flow-Ups fit into the grand scheme of things? Do they already have seniority numbers?

If so, where will they (most likely) be in an SLI? Ahead of all the furloughs? Ahead of active pilots at US?

 

253 already have AA numbers and would need new-hire classes to move. The top hundred or so are mixed among the junior 3-400 and the rest at at the very bottom. The 846 would be offered new-hire positions if their grievance award survives the chapter 11 process. Many of the 253 might pass and stay at AE depending on age and financials.

As I said before, even AMR is open to merger and most believe this U marriage will happen. Most likely, Horton will be the One World messiah and the other bandits will have likely collected their booty and moved on, so it would be Parker presiding over the marriage of Jack the Ripper and Lizzy Bordon. The combination of the two will have the least motivated workforce in the history if the airline industry, but perhaps to some that isn't important. Stand alone or hooked up to U, either way I have difficulty seeing AA surviving this BK with any optimism.

I'd love to hear a believable explanation myself of how this will all work, but so far that hasn't materialized.

 

First post ever...

As a retired commercial pilot with 38 plus years in the cockpit I have a few observations concerning the AA/TWA thread regarding seniority integration and AA's plight now. I read all the preceding threads and had a big chuckle.

The day you decided to fly for a commercial carrier how did you chose "your" airline? Did you chose the one with the best routes, or the best equipment, or the best chance for advancement, or the best looking uniforms, or the best looking flight attendants (oops...dating myself!), or the one that was hiring at the time, or had the best balance sheet, or the one that accepted you?

The point is no matter how you ended up with "your" airline, you personally had virtually nothing to do with its success or failure, now or in the future. Management and Government play the major parts. Sure you can give up wages and benefits but you are only temporarily "fixing" management's decisions.

So, with the fact that we commercial pilots are all the same, interchangeable, numbers that do a great job of getting us all safely from A to B, why would one group feel so superior over another? If you are a pilot for a carrier that is doing well or at least doing better that another, does that make you, a better pilot or person, than the less fortunate one? It's the luck of the draw! It could happen to any of us.

And now it has...Never mind about who's the "biggest... has the most routes"...blah, blah, blah! What did any of us have to do with that?! The fact is the "biggest" back in 2001 is not so "big" anymore. And aren't those AA pilots blaming it all on management? How ironic is that?

My point is that which goes around comes around or Karma or whatever. Treat your peers as you would want to be treated, because you could be the next one with the short end of the stick, through no fault of your own.

By the way, I personally attended the bankruptcy hearings in Delaware in 2001 and I could go on for days about what really happened, but no matter what I said about that, there would be nothing but sniping and arguing about those facts.

I hope that all the AA pilots, as well as the flight attendants and ground personnel, get a fair and equitable outcome in their quest to survive in their chosen profession. Wouldn't that be something?

Fraternally yours,

Just along for the ride!

 

Latest upgrades had a couple of 1998 DOH Captains at AA.

 

Thanks for sharing. The AA/TWA merger set a bad presedent. APA was so busy stapling TWA they allowed AMR to give all TWA NYC/ San Juan flying to Jetblue. They allowed NY to Tele viv the best airline (profit) route today to be thrown out. If only AA could have based intergration on pilot to airplane ratio they would have worked toward something equitable. I have no dog in this fight but it amazes me how CAL Bought NY air, Peoples Express and Frontier and they made out pretty good little to no fighting today. Your weaker, bankrupt and we saved you. We need to kill this ME ME ME mentality. I hope this is a opportunity to fix that list at AA.

 

So if APA had given TWA DOH AA wouldn't have shrunk?

Fascinating.

Here everyone else thought it was part of a failed business plan by Gerard Arpey.

 

What a great first post! One of the best I've read on here.

 

What Cap'n Larry is saying is this: Noone has a crystal ball.

Noone on this board (or any other MB) can say with any degree of certainty what their airline/job will look like in 1 year/5 years/10 years or at retirement. Anyone who says otherwise is a complete fool...or just a damn liar.