You misunderstand me, I don't care if someone wants to park in the right seat and enjoy their trips and QOL. Just don't complain that you can't upgrade because a 717 Captain seat is an upgrade.

Alfa,

You're incorrect on a very important point.

For those who come from the regionals, it's not a question of getting "high and mighty". We know that the majority of applicants coming up will most likely be found qualified by a fair selection process. We also understand that average qualifications will fluctuate industry-wide, based on supply and demand. But we also know that some of the refuse of the industry hides within. There are people there that under no circumstances should be allowed to fly our passengers, for example the Captain in the ALB accident. We didn't want to fly as their FO's then, and don't want to fly as their Captain in the future. Those people are toxic. For some of them, there is a correlation with having a degree. Some, not all. None of this would be a problem, as long as Delta's hiring process, which found you and I qualified, is used to validate them as well. In other words, it's not a question of origins, but of whether or not the filters are removed.

While I agree that we should lend a hand, I think, at the most basic level, that people are gun shy about this whole thing because we were circumvented in the negotiation of it. We could have risen as a high and mighty pilot group together and said "let's bring them all here and give them shelter, but only if XYZ". And I assume XYZ would look similar to what we have now.

What my concern is, is that we're going to bypass exceptional applicants in order to interview the PNCL pilots. Which if they're so great - they should have gotten hired - not me. Now - sure - you can say they'll be held to the same standard and they may all fail, but I think we're concerned about complications from selecting a substandard product because we have to. But I haven't seen their resumes so I can only assume they're still at PNCL by choice, not because of rejection. Even though 85% of them saw a massive concessionary agreement as a good enough thing to vote yes on.

I'm sure I'll have some great bridge program FOs someday. But one bad one will sour the image of the whole bunch. What better way to mitigate that issue than by including the opinions of 12000 people who like to number 2 all over themselves.

And if you're that high and mighty to be adamantly against this because they're "RJ pilots" google "two girls one cup".

I did misunderstand you and completely agree with your analysis. What I have seen with others and myself is that the "minimum" desired Captain seat keeps getting pushed further away mostly due to the domestication of the 7er flying.

I also give that "huh" look when folks gripe about not being able to move to the left seat when in reality they could hold it for years.

Agreed - many of the decision makers have normalized the deviance and refuse to maintain exceptionally high standards to weed out the incapable few. Since the incapable few have found a place to accumulate, we should be concerned now about their mobility. Not stereotyping or name calling, and DAL is guilty of this same issue themselves, but there are some regional pilots that I assure you operate by luck only. I'd suggest, at the least, that their training records at PNCL be given extra scrutiny and they be held to equal standards of a street hire.

That's not pooping on anyone, that's suggesting that with a broadened group of applicants, we have no reason to lower our standards, or to be merciful.

I think some of you guys are making wayyyy too much out of this supposed secret letter flow thing.

Delta just got done with a merger with NWA. So in effect, Delta just 'hired' over 5,000 mainline Capts. and F/O's, none of whom interviewed with Delta, or, if they were interviewed by Delta, they turned Delta down for NW, or vice versa.

And before that merger, there was the Pan Am and Western mergeres and before that, the North East pilots, many, many, many of whom had no college at all.

But somehow, Delta survived.

Yes, there were (and still are) a few oddballs, but Delta hired plenty of them too, with 4 year degrees and Military training, they even got by Dr. Janis. There's always that 5%, right?

Having a College Degree doesn't make you a good person or a good pilot, being a good person does. That's why they interview, and they do a background check, made even easier today with them looking at your Facebook page and training records. I'm sure they will do all the required checks on all flows, college or not.

How nice. A RJ pilot affirmative action program, which puts Pinnacle's senior employed Captains ahead of other ALPA members who lost their jobs.

Meanwhile we conveniently ignore the fact Pinnacle exists because we outsource work. Pinnacle got a 25% pay cut in exchange for this "promise" from management to hire Delta pilots.

If a better idea could be submitted; STOP OUTSOURCING ! ( make 'em Delta pilots if you want, but the selling of vague employment rights in exchange for DECREASING wages and working conditions are results our union should be ashamed of )

DISCLAIMER: I use the "royal we" in as much as the Delta MEC was not a participant in this negotiation between Delta management and Delta pilot labor.

I've got a speed record you 777 guys can't touch.
It was right there in that part of the world. On a flight from Kadena to Cubi Point in a P-3 we slowed down, put the flaps out and actually flew backwards. About 180 knots of true airspeed and a 200 knot headwind resulted in about 20 knots of backward ground speed.

The mighty Orion. Hauled a lot of San Miguel.

http://www.airpowerworld.info/other-...-p-3-orion.jpg

I find it astounding that Lee Moak would even consider signing the contract. What professional organization allows its members to work for poverty level wages? 25 percent paycuts and 50 percent retirement cuts on top of higher health care costs. Meet DL's new preferred lift provider courtesy of... US!

Definition of value Flow/"Pref" interview:

...how many rolls of toilet paper you got?

..."DeltaS" take "Trans" RJ pilots? LOL! :rolleyes: