I agree. Delta pilots only in our lounges. No DCI pilots, no flight attendants. I always wonder why there are sometimes FA's using the computers in the ATL pilot lounge when their lounge is right across the road. We never go in to the DCI pilot lounges.

Carl,

I certainly won't disagree with the part about the profit sharing, but the reps were fully aware of the additional jumbo RJ's as that was what the negotiations were predicated on.

Interesting enough, but pay banding (which I am against) has been suggested many times by "guess who" at various LEC meetings? Line pilots. I have no knowledge as to whether it is being considered or not at the MEC level, but if it is, it isn't like they came up with the idea on their own.

Two things about extending the training freeze, it had been suggested before (again from line pilots on the old forum) as a way to "force" seats to go more junior, but the response from ALPA "experts" was that beyond a couple of years, there was really no cost advantage to the company. (And they provided some data)

I know some insiders frequent this forum, maybe they can comment on the difference between a 2 and 5 year freeze and how much it theoretically might save?

Also, although most pilots are not single issue voters, when you see something as extreme as a 5 year freeze during a period of upward seat movement, I think that would be a possible deal breaker for many.

He's not saying discussions are taking place now.

He's saying they will be a factor in C15 negotiations.

But you knew that. Or are you going to state for the record that they won't be on the table for C15?

A's out. Still no backdoor Bs.

On another note, I recently had Crew Tracking tell me I had to accept 2 hour duty extension without any choice, it was a contractual obligation. They changed their tune a bit when pressed, but then said it would be a fitness for duty issue if I declined and I'd have to talk to CP. And of course no one even contacted us, or mentioned the flight was delayed, until I noticed things were taking us an hour over our "max duty" printed on the rotation.

That's not how I understood all the changes and FAA interpretations.
All the back and forth here, as well as this event with company, convinces me that without a lawyer on the phone, you can't really be sure what your obligations or limits are in the middle of an IROP. I was absolutely flat out told I had no choice in the matter, and then pushed veeeerry strongly.

I doubt they will be much of a issue. It's much ado about nothing. Lots of data on airlines with pay banding. Very minimal effect on overall training. Combine that with the fact we are almost pay banded now with our rates it has little meaning. As I post over and over follow the money. The company has not asked for it because it's value is very slight.

Because you know that going in there is like visiting the restroom at a dive bar. :D

And Now the other side of this statement:

The Union (leadership AND representatives) should do what the pilots expect them to do...fight for the best and most lucrative contract they can get...not just settle for a "risk adverse" compromise.

LP

Back door B's out LAX
 

W. T. F.

LAX pairing credits suck! Back to reserve, why the heck did we allow the company until Nov to pay ADC 5:15 and we gave the short call away right now? Who the frick agreed to that! LAX got shafted again....:mad:

The McFadden interpretation says that there has to be concurrence between the Pic and dispatcher to extend. It seems almost all 121 airlines including ours is ignoring this interpretation and making negative repercussions for pilots who refuse to extend. Our company just treats it like a fatigue call. For those of you who don't know, if you call in fatigue, you will have to explain yourself to a chief pilot. This in itself is a negative experience even if nothing becomes of it. Almost all of us will just fly fatigued the next time to avoid the negative experience. This is the same reason why phone calls cause sick calls to drop dramatically. I didn't want to extend last month. I posted it on here. I ended up extending because it was the path of least resistance. I felt extreme pressure to extend from everyone including my captain. Thanks to our new FAR's and our dropping of our contractual mins, we will soon have pilots flying 16:30 hour duty days. Not extending should be the path of least resistance. As it is now, more pilots are flying fatigued than ever. Far 117 is a major failure and more accidents will eventually happen due to fatigue.