Originally Posted by LeineLodge (Post 809918)

Yesterday we were planned with 1800 lbs of Taxi fuel, which is over a thousand more than normal on the 320. Of course we only burned about 400 getting out to the runway. I understand that you can use up to 1000 lbs of unused pad to make up the difference, but we were still 400 lbs over that (Still with me? :D)

Essentially 1400 lbs over the TOGW that was listed on the WDR update. What are our options? We screwed around long enough looking for the answer/talking to dispatch (who didn't seem to understand the problem) that we burned the 400 lbs of fuel, and just went with the original numbers. This obviously is not ideal, and a huge waste of time and fuel.

What is the best way to handle this situation? When queried, dispatch sent us a complete FDRA via ACARS, which comes out to 41 separate messages. Do Captains just amend over the phone, get a new burn, and request new WDR data? Any insight would be great, as this was a very simple issue, with really no obvious solution to us.

Originally Posted by fishguy79 (Post 809922)

A lot of Captains I fly with on the ER want the reduced power number used based on ramp weight not estimated taxi weight. That way we avoid that problem. Not sure if that would work on the 320 though.

Originally Posted by Denny Crane (Post 809885)

I do believe you are correct. The question is......how long is the freeze? I looked and could not find anything in the contract with regards to 88 to 90 training. My guess is that it is similar to 767 domestic to ER. In other words a 9 month freeze but I would call the union or company to double check that one!!

Denny

Originally Posted by 1234 (Post 809908)

New,

The MD88 is the same category as the MD90 and they are all just called the M88 for bidding purposes. If you go from the DC9 to the M88 (which includes the MD90) you will incur a 2 year freeze.

From the email we got today:
DC9 vs. M88
The DC-9 and MD-88/90 are flown under the same type rating, but the differences are such that initial training is required for DC-9 pilots awarded an MD-88 category or vice versa. Therefore, DC-9 pilots awarded an M88 category and MD-88 pilots awarded a DC-9 category both incur a two-year category freeze.

Originally Posted by LeineLodge (Post 809935)

We had plenty of room in the RATOW and Climb limits to take off. The concern we had was that we were more than 1000 lbs over the TOGW, thus using up more than the 1000 lbs of pad.

Another issue we were thinking about (which stems from an old NWA way) was that we were more than 1000 lbs heavier (NWA called this a payload pad, and it varied by mileage) and our burn calculations would be off because we were now heavier. Now 1000 lbs isn't going to be that big of a deal, but let's say you were 10,000 lbs heavier. Where do you draw the line? The FOM says we need an ammended release if we are more than 1000 lbs over the planned TOGW - if I'm remembering correctly. I'm assuming this is for things like burn, drift down terrain clearance, etc. ie limits not runway specific. I had assumed this was the reason that we could only have a 1000 lbs of pad, even if the runway and climb limits were not a factor at the higher weight.

Am I making any sense?

Originally Posted by newKnow (Post 809877)

Hey. I can't find it in the right place, so this is a guess.

If I go to the -90, there is no freeze if I want to go to the -88 in another base. (MSP to NYC)

But, if I go to the -88, there is a freeze if I wanted to go to the -90, right? (NYC to MSP)

Originally Posted by UncleSam (Post 809981)

Just saw this in the ATA Smartbrief:

Location: Atlanta, GA
Salary Range: varies with experience
Manager - Crew Resource Management/Threat and Error Management Delta Air Lines

This has been an active pilot position in the past but they are apparently now going outside the company to fill the position. Guess we might see more of that in the future.

Originally Posted by RockyBoy (Post 809979)

No freeze to go from the -88 to the -90. They did away with that in Jan 08 when they stopped training us in the sim and went to training us with a CD. FO's only do a CD for training while Captains have to have one leg with a LCA in addition to the CD, no more sim so no more freeze.