Details on Delta TA
06-07-2015, 12:37 PM
#6012
Back on TDY
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Originally Posted by GucciBoy
What info do you have regarding the conditions of the TA? Your letter sounds like you are aware of the agreement's terms.
Carl
06-07-2015, 12:45 PM
#6013
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Permanently scarred
Posts: 1,707
Ok, so all we have is rumors at this point. BUT, the rumors we do have are all negative. Well, to most of us they're negative. Maybe giving up 5% of PS for 5% of pay and adding 2% on top of that is fine for some, but I think MOST of us can agree that in this environment (i.e. with the multiple BILLIONS in profit the company is making and the increased number of BILLIONS in profit the company is expected to make) that something more is needed in this TA, right?
So riddle me this: Who in the HE double hockey sticks can put up any kind of defense for such horse squeeze? I mean, who are these APC members and where did they come from? About all that is justifiable in a sane world is for an APCer who doesn't want to buy into the notion that there might be more truth to the (very likely) rumor of a turd coming in this TA to say, "Hey, I'm not willing to say no until I see what's in it." Other than that or, "I heard it was not as bad as the rest of you seem to think." But any talk like "Are you willing to wait 3 years if it's turned down." or the like is unbelievable. Seriously? That just boggles the mind. Apparently this kind of individual would take 4/1/1/1 with 4% given back in PS and concessions in sick leave, scope, and LCA OE bumps.
Again, who are these APCers and are they even part of our pilot group?
So riddle me this: Who in the HE double hockey sticks can put up any kind of defense for such horse squeeze? I mean, who are these APC members and where did they come from? About all that is justifiable in a sane world is for an APCer who doesn't want to buy into the notion that there might be more truth to the (very likely) rumor of a turd coming in this TA to say, "Hey, I'm not willing to say no until I see what's in it." Other than that or, "I heard it was not as bad as the rest of you seem to think." But any talk like "Are you willing to wait 3 years if it's turned down." or the like is unbelievable. Seriously? That just boggles the mind. Apparently this kind of individual would take 4/1/1/1 with 4% given back in PS and concessions in sick leave, scope, and LCA OE bumps.
Again, who are these APCers and are they even part of our pilot group?
06-07-2015, 12:48 PM
#6014
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,909
Originally Posted by TripleF
A 3% inflation rate YOY is not realistic. If you look at data on st. louis federal reserve bank's website, the dollar is buying MORE. Also, look at exchange rates with other currencies. The dollar is STRONGER.
06-07-2015, 12:53 PM
#6015
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,909
Originally Posted by Carl Spackler
The Council 1 update showed me the TA gave a shopping cart full of concessions to management. The Council 1 update also showed me that our cart was not very full. The MEC administration's constant denigration of profit sharing tells me there's a cut in profit sharing. Another source tells me there are indeed scope concessions. That'll do it for me.
Carl
Carl
06-07-2015, 12:58 PM
#6016
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,503
Originally Posted by Army80
BTW, the very definition of "Negotiate" means to deal or bargain with another or others. The only reason the company hasn't "iced" us and gone into the usual 3-5 year contract model is that they need something.
Originally Posted by Army80
I'm willing to see what it is and what value we can garner from their needs. Your belief that we should not deal with or bargain with the company would never get us a deal. It's unrealistic and will cost the pilot group.
If we don't like the deal we can vote no.
If we don't like the deal we can vote no.
I can tell you now. If the rumored give backs are only half true, and the rumored rates are accurate, we didn't get anything other concessionary contract in the most wildly profitable era of the airline industry, that has benefited and continues to from their new pricing paradigm. Unbundled Fees
How much was that stock buy back and dividend package for?
Time to move labor peace to the edge of the table. Careful with that! That labor peace is made of fine bone China. It breaks easily.
06-07-2015, 01:03 PM
#6017
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,909
Originally Posted by Army80
We all pay dues. Some have to mention it all the time.
Do you think the rep you sent your email to said, "Wait a minute, I got a message from a guy that pays dues, better put that one at the top of the list." ?
BTW, the very definition of "Negotiate" means to deal or bargain with another or others. The only reason the company hasn't "iced" us and gone into the usual 3-5 year contract model is that they need something. I'm willing to see what it is and what value we can garner from their needs. Your belief that we should not deal with or bargain with the company would never get us a deal. It's unrealistic and will cost the pilot group.
If we don't like the deal we can vote no.
Do you think the rep you sent your email to said, "Wait a minute, I got a message from a guy that pays dues, better put that one at the top of the list." ?
BTW, the very definition of "Negotiate" means to deal or bargain with another or others. The only reason the company hasn't "iced" us and gone into the usual 3-5 year contract model is that they need something. I'm willing to see what it is and what value we can garner from their needs. Your belief that we should not deal with or bargain with the company would never get us a deal. It's unrealistic and will cost the pilot group.
If we don't like the deal we can vote no.
Sure, contracts are give and take. The last one was their take and this one is their give! And if they don't want to give, I'll take their accidental give (profit sharing) as is in the current contract.
06-07-2015, 01:10 PM
#6018
New Hire
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 5
Originally Posted by TED74
Problem is, my house isn't in Greece, and the one I do own went very underwater.
I sold my home several years ago for a gain. For there to be winners, there must be losers.
06-07-2015, 01:10 PM
#6019
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Posts: 1,101
Originally Posted by TED74
The only rep I've heard talking with my own ears (pilot lounge in Atlanta) was doing zero listening. He was transmit-only trying to convince two sequential PS supporters that they were wrong to want it untouched.
06-07-2015, 01:13 PM
#6020
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2015
Posts: 181
Originally Posted by TheManager
Easy. Profit sharing give backs. We've been over this ad nauseam
I think they WANT to get off the PS water board they climbed up on, but they can still make a butt load of money and they don't HAVE to get off. IOW, if it costs too much, they can afford to say no.
I can tell you now. If the rumored give backs are only half true, and the rumored rates are accurate, we didn't get anything other concessionary contract in the most wildly profitable era of the airline industry, that has benefited and continues to from their new pricing paradigm. Unbundled Fees
We will find out for real what the deal is on Tuesday. I hope your rumors are not true. I am willing to listen to all and have an open mind. I fear that many are so upset with DALPA that they cannot approach any deal with an open mind.
How much was that stock buy back and dividend package for?
The buy back stuff worries me. I see the rebirth of Leo and Michelle Burns with that one. Not good.
Time to move labor peace to the edge of the table. Careful with that! That labor peace is made of fine bone China. It breaks easily.
I think they WANT to get off the PS water board they climbed up on, but they can still make a butt load of money and they don't HAVE to get off. IOW, if it costs too much, they can afford to say no.
I can tell you now. If the rumored give backs are only half true, and the rumored rates are accurate, we didn't get anything other concessionary contract in the most wildly profitable era of the airline industry, that has benefited and continues to from their new pricing paradigm. Unbundled Fees
We will find out for real what the deal is on Tuesday. I hope your rumors are not true. I am willing to listen to all and have an open mind. I fear that many are so upset with DALPA that they cannot approach any deal with an open mind.
How much was that stock buy back and dividend package for?
The buy back stuff worries me. I see the rebirth of Leo and Michelle Burns with that one. Not good.
Time to move labor peace to the edge of the table. Careful with that! That labor peace is made of fine bone China. It breaks easily.
Fly Safe
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