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-   -   Envoy 2021: A New Hope (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/envoy-airlines/131993-envoy-2021-new-hope.html)

CptnDave 02-21-2021 07:03 PM


Originally Posted by Seneca Pilot (Post 3198001)
Wow, I could have skipped basic and AIT. All those runs, and push ups, and endless classes on tactics. Skipped the months of helicopter maintenance training. I could have skipped jump school and the fear of a broken ankle on every jump. Skipped Air Assault school and the rappelling from a helicopter and the twelve mile ruck march. And SERE level C with the evading, eating whatever we could find, drinking iodine water and the very realistic POW experience. And dunker training. And the joys of Desert Shield and Desert Storm with the horrible shots we had to take including the frozen one that left a huge lump on your ass for a week, and the depleted Uranium rounds making some of us sick (I was lucky, no effects yet).

All I had to do was go to a surplus store and buy some web gear and boots, and spend a few weekends doing some reenactments to get my military experience and cred? I must be stupid.

Nah bro "military background" jeez dude get it right, guys like you have no idea what its like for THKooj. Sometimes during the reenactments random people would go on jogs through the "battlefield" and it would really throw off the realism!

NoValueAviator 02-22-2021 05:18 AM


Originally Posted by Crimson37Roger (Post 3197891)
or I’ll just read back what ATC says and make sure you turn down the correct bridge. Been doin this a while buddy, no need to act like you’re any better than anyone because you’ve been at this company longer.

If you can successfully read back the clearance accurately without using short hand then you aren't who I'm talking about and I'm confused why you're even talking to me. I guess trying to flex that you're the radio king? Contact crew scheduling.

Crimson37Roger 02-22-2021 06:09 AM


Originally Posted by NoValueAviator (Post 3198118)
If you can successfully read back the clearance accurately without using short hand then you aren't who I'm talking about and I'm confused why you're even talking to me. I guess trying to flex that you're the radio king? Contact crew scheduling.

nah, tbh I misread the first message I replied to but then I had to keep it going.

ElCaribe 02-23-2021 10:00 PM


Originally Posted by THKooj (Post 3197378)
I've explained this on another forum of which I'm sure you read my explanation. However, for the benefit of some here, I'll briefly cover it again. As mentioned already, I personally had issues with the RTP program. Because these guys were military, and in order to criticize this position, I felt I could share and relate my own experience as a Vietnam War re-enactor to have some leg to stand on in understanding where these guys were coming from. I spent over 6 months as a re-enactor in some of the most real life scenarios imaginable. I was assigned to an Army unit and became extremely familiar with all things Army as everything was replicated perfectly, right down to military issue boots. So, there's your background. It's more than many Americans have who have no military service.

I commend these RTP guys for their service, however, they were not what Envoy needed. As mentioned, they took a slot away from a highly trained cadet. Cadets had the highest evaluation marks and pass rate in the history of Envoy by the way. As said, the RTP guy would come in and get his or her hand held through the program, make it online, and struggle afterward for quite some time. When they got the hang of it and built some hours, they usually would bail for some legacy as their military service checked some special box or something over there. I voiced my concern over and over but the program was kept afloat until the pandemic began. Hopefully now we have seen the last of RTP.

You are by far my favorite poster to read on APC. Never a dull post.

NotChewbacca 02-24-2021 07:41 AM

Anyone got any insight on PHX. We’re slowly (at least according to AirPortal) increasing flying there. Is it going to continue or is this just the 75s version of CLT?

pitchattitude 02-24-2021 08:53 AM


Originally Posted by NotChewbacca (Post 3198989)
Anyone got any insight on PHX. We’re slowly (at least according to AirPortal) increasing flying there. Is it going to continue or is this just the 75s version of CLT?

Its not going to be a base if that’s what you’re getting at. It’s just AAG juggling the schedule and the ‘Voy doing through flying to cover it.

aewhistleblower 02-24-2021 11:23 AM

I’ve been hearing rumors that TC is going to Atlas. Can anyone confirm this?

oldrebel 02-24-2021 12:54 PM

I wouldn’t be surprised

Dougweiser 02-24-2021 01:08 PM


Originally Posted by aewhistleblower (Post 3199104)
I’ve been hearing rumors that TC is going to Atlas. Can anyone confirm this?

Yep I can confirm

JungleJetBoss 02-24-2021 01:57 PM


Originally Posted by Dougweiser (Post 3199136)
Yep I can confirm

Same
He will be leaving

Swakid8 02-24-2021 05:21 PM


Originally Posted by JungleJetBoss (Post 3199161)
Same
He will be leaving

Is he a cool dude or no?

Cujo665 02-24-2021 05:46 PM

I said over a decade ago that the company was built by much smarter people than the ones running the show currently. That all they knew how to do was to grease the wheels somebody else built and put in place. That means beating and threatening people into compliance. Increasing wages and working conditions as a last resort. When something out of the ordinary happens they go into instant analysis paralysis.... nobody wanting to do anything, for fear of being told they were wrong later. The end result is the whole thing grinds to a screeching halt.

As totally predictable a decade ago, as it is now.

Cujo665 02-24-2021 05:52 PM


Originally Posted by Swakid8 (Post 3199246)
Is he a cool dude or no?

Very good guy, and he'll be much happier being treated like an adult, compensated better, and when hiring does pick up again, he'll be applying as a heavy driver with international experience.

Cujo665 02-24-2021 05:59 PM


Originally Posted by coodrough568 (Post 3199256)
what happened, are you referencing the snow debacle?

Yes, sorry. I should have been more clear about the topic

Swakid8 02-24-2021 07:08 PM


Originally Posted by Cujo665 (Post 3199257)
Very good guy, and he'll be much happier being treated like an adult, compensated better, and when hiring does pick up again, he'll be applying as a heavy driver with international experience.

Do ya know if he coming to the 74 or 76 side? I will have to keep a eye out for those initials on the seniority list. I agree, I am so far much happier here vs my previous WO.

Cyio 02-25-2021 07:31 AM


Originally Posted by Swakid8 (Post 3199293)
Do ya know if he coming to the 74 or 76 side? I will have to keep a eye out for those initials on the seniority list. I agree, I am so far much happier here vs my previous WO.

He is a great guy and will be an asset to your company. 74 I believe.

BigZ 02-25-2021 07:46 AM

One more vote into the great guy pile

aewhistleblower 02-25-2021 07:57 AM

He’s gonna be missed! Now, would we have a new election or ER is taking over?

Cyio 02-25-2021 08:44 AM


Originally Posted by aewhistleblower (Post 3199403)
He’s gonna be missed! Now, would we have a new election or ER is taking over?

I would think a new election, however I’m sure ER would handle it until it was complete.

ClappedOut145 02-25-2021 03:33 PM


Originally Posted by Cyio (Post 3199432)
I would think a new election, however I’m sure ER would handle it until it was complete.

They have to do an interim for the rest of the term. That’s what they did when TC took over for SP in 2019 when he flowed. TC was elected for the remainder of the term. I would think if the rumors are true then there would be some sort of announcement to the pilots of a vacancy? Anybody can run that is in good standing. Maybe The Commander should do it.

Cyio 02-25-2021 03:39 PM


Originally Posted by ClappedOut145 (Post 3199561)
They have to do an interim for the rest of the term. That’s what they did when TC took over for SP in 2019 when he flowed. TC was elected for the remainder of the term. I would think if the rumors are true then there would be some sort of announcement to the pilots of a vacancy? Anybody can run that is in good standing. Maybe The Commander should do it.

Yeah I agree, you stated much more eloquently, but that was what I was trying to say.

CLE to IAH 02-25-2021 03:56 PM

fake news.

Nobody EVER leaves AMERICAN AIRLINES (regionals) for ACMIs or dumpy little narrow body carriers like spirit!


signed,


1LT THBoob

Battalion S9, special assignments- Re-enactments
5th Infantry Delusion

Cyio 02-25-2021 04:01 PM


Originally Posted by CLE to IAH (Post 3199569)
Nobody EVER leaves AMERICAN AIRLINES (regionals) for ACMIs or dumpy little narrow body carriers like spirit!


signed,


1LT THBoob

Battalion S9, special assignments- Re-enactments
5th Infantry Delusion

I think there are going to be many leaving the AA universe soon.

Helij3t 02-25-2021 04:25 PM


Originally Posted by CLE to IAH (Post 3199569)
fake news.

Nobody EVER leaves AMERICAN AIRLINES (regionals) for ACMIs or dumpy little narrow body carriers like spirit!


signed,


1LT THBoob

Battalion S9, special assignments- Re-enactments
5th Infantry Delusion


😂😂😂😂😂 You made my day👍.

you can slap all ranks on him. He's probably undergoing periodic PTSD counseling sustained during his 6 month deployment in hollywood vietnam. His trigger is from the jungle boots he wore so please let's all be informed and help with him with his road to recovery during these unprecedented times. 🙏

But seriously 02-25-2021 04:35 PM


Originally Posted by ClappedOut145 (Post 3199561)
They have to do an interim for the rest of the term. That’s what they did when TC took over for SP in 2019 when he flowed. TC was elected for the remainder of the term. I would think if the rumors are true then there would be some sort of announcement to the pilots of a vacancy? Anybody can run that is in good standing. Maybe The Commander should do it.

I’m sure he’ll send out an “it’s been an honor to serve this pilot group” email as soon as he hands in his notice to the company.

I’m pretty sure his term was up in Sep, and elections require 90 days, so we were only a few months from new elections anyway.

I never really had any interactions with him, but I haven’t heard a bunch of bad things, so... I guess that’s a positive?

martyByrde 02-25-2021 08:42 PM


Originally Posted by CLE to IAH (Post 3199569)
fake news.

Nobody EVER leaves AMERICAN AIRLINES (regionals) for ACMIs or dumpy little narrow body carriers like spirit!


signed,


1LT THBoob

Battalion S9, special assignments- Re-enactments
5th Infantry Delusion

THKooj.............

AkPilot99 02-25-2021 09:25 PM


Originally Posted by Helij3t (Post 3199575)
😂😂😂😂😂 You made my day👍.

you can slap all ranks on him. He's probably undergoing periodic PTSD counseling sustained during his 6 month deployment in hollywood vietnam. His trigger is from the jungle boots he wore so please let's all be informed and help with him with his road to recovery during these unprecedented times. 🙏

Have you not seen tropic thunder??? That stuff can do a number to re-enactors...

Helij3t 02-26-2021 05:33 AM


Originally Posted by AkPilot99 (Post 3199658)
Have you not seen tropic thunder??? That stuff can do a number to re-enactors...

​​​​​ Unfortunately I haven't seen it. Nothing can be compared to actual conditions when you can pause, play or edit simulated. When you start exchanging fire with the enemy, there's no story line until you survive to tell the story. Reenactors can walk off the stage😄😄😄 and still claim side effects like Uncle Thekool J.

havick206 02-26-2021 06:04 AM


Originally Posted by Helij3t (Post 3199709)
​​​​​ Unfortunately I haven't seen it. Nothing can be compared to actual conditions when you can pause, play or edit simulated. When you start exchanging fire with the enemy, there's no story line until you survive to tell the story. Reenactors can walk off the stage😄😄😄 and still claim side effects like Uncle Thekool J.

I think you may be immune to sarcasm in people’s posts.

Seneca Pilot 02-26-2021 06:15 AM


Originally Posted by Helij3t (Post 3199709)
​​​​​ Unfortunately I haven't seen it. Nothing can be compared to actual conditions when you can pause, play or edit simulated. When you start exchanging fire with the enemy, there's no story line until you survive to tell the story. Reenactors can walk off the stage😄😄😄 and still claim side effects like Uncle Thekool J.


Having a friend nearly die and end up with third degree burns on his legs and feet and seeing it all from the next helicopter over. Walking away from an accident where the transmission accessory module missed me by inches because the pilots lost SA due to a brownout and seeing that the other crew chief wasn't so lucky. Having a close friend and pilot die in his Chinook when the other pilot got disoriented and they were so close to the water he didn't have time to react. Being on the wrong side of a line of tracers and hoping they don't find you tonight. Being on the correct side of those tracers and having to live with the sight of what .30 cal. does to a truck full of enemy men when fired at 3000 rounds per minute. Watching one of four blades break in half as the rotor spins down and realizing that centrifugal force was the only thing keeping you alive after the RPG hit the disk.

I should be dead. Those are only some of the stories. I haven't felt, or maybe just haven't admitted to any long lasting effects psychologically. I can only say that I no longer have the capacity for fear. This can be a very bad thing when being in traffic with selfish drivers or any number of other every day situations. My neighbor who was a crew chief in Vietnam feels much the same. He crashed or was shot down eight times in the 13 months he served in the Americal Division. He was there from '68 into '69 and went through Tet. Combat affects everyone differently but there are always scars. His are poor hearing, both knees replaced, and terrible arthritis from the beating his body suffered in all those crashes.

Needles to say, I don't have patience for any stolen valor BS. Tkooj do yourself a favor and keep it to yourself.

Cujo665 02-26-2021 08:00 AM


Originally Posted by aewhistleblower (Post 3199403)
He’s gonna be missed! Now, would we have a new election...

One vying for the job is openly interviewing and trying to get on elsewhere already..... not sure what he's thinking even wanting the job if he's already one foot out the door.

If I were you guys, I'd recruit a lifer that isn't going to leave.... get long term stability into the leadership.... oh, and not a check airman, instructor or anybody else the company can get to behind the scenes. A DFW guy would be a plus to avoid all the hotel and related expenses, it adds up. You'd also get somebody who put the interest of making Envoy a better job rather than selling wages and work rules for "faster flow" (how's that working out?)

THKooj 02-26-2021 12:12 PM


Originally Posted by Cujo665 (Post 3199784)
One vying for the job is openly interviewing and trying to get on elsewhere already..... not sure what he's thinking even wanting the job if he's already one foot out the door.

If I were you guys, I'd recruit a lifer that isn't going to leave.... get long term stability into the leadership.... oh, and not a check airman, instructor or anybody else the company can get to behind the scenes. A DFW guy would be a plus to avoid all the hotel and related expenses, it adds up. You'd also get somebody who put the interest of making Envoy a better job rather than selling wages and work rules for "faster flow" (how's that working out?)

Ever thought about maybe trying to get hired as a permanent MEC chair? Seems like that might be right up your alley.

NoValueAviator 02-26-2021 04:08 PM


Originally Posted by THKooj (Post 3199921)
Ever thought about maybe trying to get hired as a permanent MEC chair? Seems like that might be right up your alley.

This would be hilarious but I have a feeling no deal would ever get signed again.

dera 02-26-2021 04:55 PM


Originally Posted by Cujo665 (Post 3199784)
One vying for the job is openly interviewing and trying to get on elsewhere already..... not sure what he's thinking even wanting the job if he's already one foot out the door.

If I were you guys, I'd recruit a lifer that isn't going to leave.... get long term stability into the leadership.... oh, and not a check airman, instructor or anybody else the company can get to behind the scenes. A DFW guy would be a plus to avoid all the hotel and related expenses, it adds up. You'd also get somebody who put the interest of making Envoy a better job rather than selling wages and work rules for "faster flow" (how's that working out?)

How would one recruit a lifer? Why would you go from a cushy lifer schedule to being the bucket everyone ****s on for less money?
Easier said than done. It is a pretty darn crap job.

NoValueAviator 02-26-2021 05:06 PM


Originally Posted by dera (Post 3200029)
money?

solved it, before start checklist.

Cujo665 02-26-2021 05:12 PM


Originally Posted by dera (Post 3200029)
How would one recruit a lifer? Why would you go from a cushy lifer schedule to being the bucket everyone ****s on for less money?
Easier said than done. It is a pretty darn crap job.

have you changed the chairman’s FPL? They used to be 90 hrs IIRC and were “supposed” to do some fly back.

How do you recruit one? Try asking a few. When I rebuilt all the committees in NY it wasn’t a stampede of people asking for jobs. It was repeated emails, Facebook posts, EL posts, and a lot of talking. As we picked up our pace and started having positive impacts on things for the pilots, more started volunteering without us seeking them out. Want a lifer, go get one. There’s probably several who’d be good, would do it, but just don’t know how to go about it.

Cujo665 02-26-2021 05:19 PM


Originally Posted by NoValueAviator (Post 3200008)
This would be hilarious but I have a feeling no deal would ever get signed again.

why? The 2014 December TA/CBA that passed was me. I was the tie breaking vote. It initially failed, I demanded a wording change to remove language that thanked ALPA national for their help getting this deal. We got more help from the APA back then. All we got from ALPA was please take this deal. Anyway, the wording was removed, motioned to reconsider and we voted again and it passed. Yours truly being the swing vote both times.
the NY base closure LOA was me.... the ALPA lawyers refused to go back in and ask what we wanted. The NY FO rep and myself went in without the lawyers and got everything we told the lawyers to go ask for, but had refused.

don’t believe everything you’ve been told. We had a really good MEC back then that worked through pretty tough times

Now, if you mean to imply the company would walk in, see me, and about face and leave.... I’d agree with that. Pretty sure the MEC threatened the company that they’d hire me as a outside contract negotiator..... they responded, “you wouldn't really do that, would you?” (By the way, for our MEC folks, if you need somebody to do or tell them something you aren’t comfortable doing, I’ll do it.... they can’t fire me anymore or even threaten it like they used to) LOL

Jerry Glass did tell a room full of management back in 2014 that I was the anti-Christ. I just called him a jackass. They threatened to fire me over that one too.

dera 02-26-2021 05:37 PM


Originally Posted by Cujo665 (Post 3200039)
have you changed the chairman’s FPL? They used to be 90 hrs IIRC and were “supposed” to do some fly back.

The required flyback amount was just increased. Senior guys get way more than 90hrs of credit with more days off. I dont see why anyone would do it. Better to enjoy those 18 day off lines with 92hrs credit, add a few OT turns and you are at 105 hours with 16 days off. Not even close to the crap the MEC chair has to deal with.


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