They cannot post it because it doesn't exist. An arbitration award has a decision (award) decided by an arbitrator with his signature at the end. That doesn't exist. What DOES exist is a Letter of Agreement (LOA) between management and Envoy ALPA. Those are two VERY different things and management sought agreement of this issue instead of risking an arbitrated decision for very important reason and that' an arbitrated award can be argued to survive a contract while an LOA cannot. Flame's assertion that it "does not matter" is an indication he knows it isn't arbitrated and the fact is it DOES matter.

The PP pilots want to believe..............no HAVE to believe nothing will impede their flow at the present rate as to consider another reality is simply to horrifying and thus denial is in full swing. Envoy pilots were similarly handed a rusty musket by the past union fiefdom when their transfer rights with aircraft were given away for so far, essentially nothing but misery. Will the Envoy flow stop after the last of the 824 ?

Not likely.

It IS however, a pivot point where AAG is then free to morph Envoy and/or other WO's into what they want to do long-term and not be encumbered with a legal hassles of an arbitration that individual pilots can claim harm as the 824. Once 824 are gone, I would look for AAG to announce the world has again changed and that Envoy PP pilots will have to accept inclusion in a more modest stream of flows including other pilots effectively slowing the flow rate for legacy Envoy pilots. Envoy ALPA will negotiate, but ultimately whatever is achieved will be a dilution of the present flow promises implied in that LOA.

What everyone is seeing here is simply the same attitudes of the past there where many pilots assume things only to have the rug pulled out from under them (again) simply because they over-assumed. Realistic expectations have NEVER been part of the Envoy pilot existence and that is why denial is so rampant and rage and hostility are then directed at those that highlight that psychological existence. But, the beat goes on to the rhythm of the tom-toms of fantasy..............

 

No need.

That LOA and a signed arbitrators award are not and have never been identical. That is simply the misguided hope of some here who want them to be and thus believe they are. AAG will be able to choke Envoy ALPA into submission just like they did before to get what they want, the only difference with the PP agreement is that (aside from 12/4 pay caps and other contractual modifications like reserve which will give THEM what they want), it will be mostly new reps that learn just like TT and the present ones (most of whom will have ejected to AA by then) how the game is played.

You'd think most Envoy pilots would have figured it out by now, but no.........at least a few here really believe this time it will be different. I feel for you guys in that way, truly I do. I think there will be some painful realities splashed in your face like ice cold water in the future if you think Envoy is going to flow PP pilots at the present rate.

 

Seriously, you sound like more of a lunatic than they guy that stands on the corner with a megaphone preaching the end of the world. He has yelled at me that the world is coming to an end in 6 months for years now. Keep hoping and preachin, Reverand.

 

........and ONCE AGAIN, we have ZERO rebuttal to the points made and only a response based on personal attack.

It also demonstrates to the forum BOTH the denial and the method needed to prevent consideration of anything other then the fantasy, that being rage and hostility at the threatening source. This character is virtually certain to be one of the fist to suffer a complete and total crack-up should his fantasy be crushed in the future.

 

I just got fitted for our new AA/WO uniforms pretty nice ..

 

Because there is nothing to rebut. You keep telling wild stories without a logical argument and basis so there is nothing of substance to counterpoint. You persist in your campaign because it prevents any real discussion. Don't worry though, I will always be here at each step of the process, to point out how wrong you are and have been.

Don't you find it significant that all your attempts to participate in the union at Eagle and now at AA have failed. The fact that in real life and on the internet, no one likes you. And yet, in your mind, it always their problem and never yours. And you accuse envoy pilots of being in denial...

 

Are the pants more modern fit and styled? I could never wear the company blues because they were so out of proportion.

 

You couldn't point out my supposed flaws if your life depended on it. To wit, your ridiculous claim of my "failings" in participating in Eagle's or AA union's is patently absurd, along with your dopey claim that "no one likes me" in life, like you know the first thing about me. I've never sought union office in either example and you know no one "in my life" just like you don't know me. I understand the compulsion to continue your personal attack as you're bankrupt of everything else. If you weren't, you'd have something factual to offer instead of emotional and all you can do is reach for empty straws of rebuttal.

Don't worry though, I will be here to provide those interested in listening (and much to your chagrin, there ARE those members here) to the more realistic viewpoint of Envoy to counter your spin and song. In fact, according to EL there IS some good news !

Apparently the schedules are so crappy that reserve in DFW has actually gone senior for captains ! Well, I guess that's not all good news as what does that say about the schedules ? Sounds like LAX is out as a future Envoy consideration, but hey.............if you guys agree to make a bad reserve system worse, they may just give you a temporary satellite base there and perhaps MIA too !

Considering many of your key reps won't have to live where they caca in the future as they'll e at AA, I wonder if history will repeat itself and the outgoing flowbies of the senior union sell the stragglers down the river ?

Look forward to a very interesting year and much to talk about regarding Envoy here. Of course, you'll have to bone up on new and impressive insults and mindless posts over the year and so, time to get cracking !

Chop ! Chop !

 

You can choose between pleaded or flat front. The uniform is surprisingly nice. 😮

 

How's this?