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Old 10-07-2019, 07:21 PM
  #701  
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Originally Posted by spaaks View Post
why aren't the guys/girls under 50 applying to the legacies? or are they and they just haven't gotten hired yet?
I was trying, but I did not renew my airlineapps subscription this year. Iím flirting with 50% company seniority, and I bid top 5% in base as a FO. All that seniority happened in well under 4 years. Iíve decided if want ďstart overĒ I will take the upgrade and be a jr. captain, instead of jr. FO at 90ish bucks a hour.
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Old 10-07-2019, 07:29 PM
  #702  
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Originally Posted by ASpilot2be View Post
I am 30, and I would retire at number 5 or 6 in the company. Personally it's hard to give that up.
Originally Posted by HeisenbergBlue View Post
If you are hired now, you would be top 40-50% company wide in 5-6 years. Get that anywhere else?
So it sounds like both of you are placing more emphasis on fast QOL achievement than career earnings, job security or anything else. I'm assuming that's how most guys feel?

Originally Posted by butthert View Post
I for one make more money and spend more time with my family flying for Frontier. I live in a nice base, drive to work and make over a quarter million a year. Why would I leave to go start over at a "legacy"??
Maybe you should ask yourself the question. Why haven't you applied to a legacy? Or have you just not gotten hired yet??
How old are you? i assume you're a 40-50 something yr old CA, in which case it probably makes sense to stay. i'm more curious about the younger/more junior crowd with 20+ years still left to go.

Originally Posted by PC12 View Post
Iím junior and Iíve moved up about 25 numbers in 5 months.
This sounds more accurate than zero attrition
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Old 10-07-2019, 07:39 PM
  #703  
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I'm not criticizing anyone here, just trying to see what the thought process of young guys choosing to stay is.

Originally Posted by SFA320 View Post
I was trying, but I did not renew my airlineapps subscription this year. Iím flirting with 50% company seniority, and I bid top 5% in base as a FO. All that seniority happened in well under 4 years. Iíve decided if want ďstart overĒ I will take the upgrade and be a jr. captain, instead of jr. FO at 90ish bucks a hour.
It sounds like you're also staying for QOL/quick seniority, but also have in the back of your head that the money isn't that much different? Let's use UA for example, yes first year pay is $91, but minimum 2nd year pay is $137 and higher if you take the 756 or 777. I'm just remembering during y'alls contract fight ALPA had that graph of how many years it would take to "break even" if you left F9 for a legacy. Obviously the numbers are different with your new contract, but the numbers were shocking, with 401K match, profit sharing....etc. I remember being surprised that ALPA was saying it was financially advantageous to go to a legacy if you were under like 50 something years old. I'd be curious to know what the number is now
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Old 10-07-2019, 07:42 PM
  #704  
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Originally Posted by spaaks View Post
So it sounds like both of you are placing more emphasis on fast QOL achievement than career earnings, job security or anything else. I'm assuming that's how most guys feel?


I feel like in the end my career earnings wont be so much less that its worth starting over. I feel my job security is probably a little better here. Especially with the way the ULCC market share is growing. Who knows, we may end up getting bought out or buy somebody down the road. The only major reason to go to a Legacy is for international flying. If you dont mind domestic, you're just as good off at Frontier as somewhere else.
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Old 10-07-2019, 07:43 PM
  #705  
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Originally Posted by ASpilot2be View Post
I feel like in the end my career earnings wont be so much less that its worth starting over. I feel my job security is probably a little better here. Especially with the way the ULCC market share is growing. Who knows, we may end up getting bought out or buy somebody down the road. The only major reason to go to a Legacy is for international flying. If you dont mind domestic, you're just as good off at Frontier as somewhere else.
yeah in terms of pay rates i agree, but do you include 401k/B fund, profit sharing when calculating the numbers? and at what age/how many years left in one's career is this the case?
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Old 10-07-2019, 07:53 PM
  #706  
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Originally Posted by spaaks View Post
yeah in terms of pay rates i agree, but do you include 401k/B fund, profit sharing when calculating the numbers?
401K, but not profit sharing because its not a guarantee. Our 401k DC will be 15% in three years, and United is at 16%. So its comparable.
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Old 10-07-2019, 08:00 PM
  #707  
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Iím in my 30ís... I hold a line as a captain... I live in base... Iíll make over 300k this year... you can be a delta 777 captain and be broke and you be a frontier fo and have a lot of money... whether youíre at delta or FedEx or frontier, if youíre smart with your earnings, youíll have a good retirement and a good life... people here like the people they work with... they live in base... they donít want to start over... they know there will be a downturn and, for now, theres some job security here... thereís myriad reasons why people stay... this is a pretty good place to work other than some annoying stuff they could easily fix
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Old 10-07-2019, 08:02 PM
  #708  
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Originally Posted by SFA320 View Post
Im mid 30ís. On a long long overnight I was bored and calculated it with birth years as well. Iím looking at retiring around 80 something. Im just under four years seniority now. Iím sure I made a mistake somewhere, but Iím confident Iím in the ballpark.
It sounds like we're fairly close in terms of overall seniority and age so I'll go with that. I guess I can live with top 100 eventually. I guess.

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Old 10-07-2019, 08:52 PM
  #709  
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Originally Posted by spaaks View Post
I'm not criticizing anyone here, just trying to see what the thought process of young guys choosing to stay is.



It sounds like you're also staying for QOL/quick seniority, but also have in the back of your head that the money isn't that much different? Let's use UA for example, yes first year pay is $91, but minimum 2nd year pay is $137 and higher if you take the 756 or 777. I'm just remembering during y'alls contract fight ALPA had that graph of how many years it would take to "break even" if you left F9 for a legacy. Obviously the numbers are different with your new contract, but the numbers were shocking, with 401K match, profit sharing....etc. I remember being surprised that ALPA was saying it was financially advantageous to go to a legacy if you were under like 50 something years old. I'd be curious to know what the number is now
No, the money is definitely part of the decision. I think to many have in the back of their minds that legacies are the only way to make a lot of money...they are not.
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Old 10-08-2019, 05:22 AM
  #710  
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Originally Posted by spaaks View Post
I'm not criticizing anyone here, just trying to see what the thought process of young guys choosing to stay is.



It sounds like you're also staying for QOL/quick seniority, but also have in the back of your head that the money isn't that much different? Let's use UA for example, yes first year pay is $91, but minimum 2nd year pay is $137 and higher if you take the 756 or 777. I'm just remembering during y'alls contract fight ALPA had that graph of how many years it would take to "break even" if you left F9 for a legacy. Obviously the numbers are different with your new contract, but the numbers were shocking, with 401K match, profit sharing....etc. I remember being surprised that ALPA was saying it was financially advantageous to go to a legacy if you were under like 50 something years old. I'd be curious to know what the number is now
I have a friend thatís a 767 captain at a legacy and I will out earn him this year and Iím in my 20s and heís in his 60s. This place is a lot more lucrative than the pay scale leads you to believe. We have a lot of soft pay and I work way less than him and donít commute.
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