After all of that, all you see is the word "horrible". Wow. Does "unacceptable" or "sub-par" make you happier? Either way, they have gone down, and fast. But, all pilots want to do is *#% and complain. Nice deflection of reality.


Pilots read this thread to learn about F9, what it's about and whether to apply. At least do them a solid service and be honest.

 

Yes. Nothing else you said I disagree with, we do have a long way to go to make this a career destination. Just from my experience (less than yours) the hotels don't qualify as horrible. When I think of the truly horrible hotels I've stayed at they don't compare.

 

There's so many variables that play into this debate that it's impossible to predict what the upgrade time will be. For now it's at two years. Let's look at the five year plan...I know that's hard to make 5 year projections but lets just try.

In the next 60 months: A quick look at the F9 seniority list shows 47 retirements (36 which are active). 100 new planes to be delivered with about 57 planes now online. Multiple sources have told me that we lose about 50-60 pilots per year. We have about 950 active pilots on the seniority list. So basically, we will be close to tripling in size.

That info alone looks promising for continued 2-3 year upgrades.

Is F9 perfect? What carrier is? Things here are looking great and I feel the long term business plan at F9 is better than any carrier in the nation which means stability and growth.

 

We compare ourselves to our peers for payrates, no reason not to for hotels.

I think that some of our pilots say we have horrible hotels, because they are comparing us to our peer groups, in some cities we stay. The cities that have Best Westerns, Holiday Inn Expresses, etc. Some of these properties actually are very nice, like in SFO or MSP. But our peers stay at higher end hotels with 30-50% discounts at the hotel restaurants. So they don't have to be happy about a free breakfast because the full service restaurant gives them an affordable one.

We need long and short hotels. Will only come with a new contract.

 

You sound exactly like I did when I first got hired at SPIRIT.

You'll soon realize Frontier, like Spirit isn't worth staying at. We are so underpaid it's sad. Depressingly sad

 

You're right, if beginning in 2017 growth starts clipping at a rate of 20 additional airplanes per year, upgrade will tick back up into the 2.5 to 3 year range. But is our growth plan really that aggressive?

 

When was that?

 

Respectfully as possible, you and the other dude that you were agreeing with are smoking crack!!! The long term business plan at F9 is better than any other carrier in the nation?? Really!!? Come on now guys, drink the Kool Aid because tastes good. I love the mathematical speculations. Very creative and entertaining...however they unfortunately lack any verifiable facts.

 

Kool Aid? I never touch the stuff. Crack on the otherhand...

But if you take a second look at my 1st post about upgrades, you'll see that I postulate that the 2 year upgrade is already over, and those hired today will have a much longer wait. I also outlined my reasons for saying such.

However, reference "the other guy" for the sake of discussion, if the fleet actually did nearly triple in 5 years as he theorizes, then he would be correct. The upgrade would hover between 2.5 to 3 years. It's very simple math actually. The main variable is the growth.

As far as verifiable facts, your post provides even less than ours did, but thanks for playing

 

Your post is simply full of assumptions and ifs, nothing factual. Regarding mine, I was ardently disagreeing with both of you. Nothing personal pal. It does however intrigue me when someone reacts to their thoughts being challenged with a passive aggressive tone. The sing-songy boy scout schtick is so tired. I'll look forward to your next reply (with emojis)!