Cujo665

Your MEC doesn't

BTW, looks like your last new hire class photo had a lot more empty seats in the room than previous shots.... applicant problems???

FirstClass

Our MEC doesn't want Envoy pilots to come over with the airplanes? I'm not in the know but I don't see why anyone would care. You either have the time to upgrade or not.

Regarding new hires, it's IOE problems. Running 37 new hires through every two weeks has created an IOE bottleneck so we have had no choice but to reduce to 50 new hire FO's per month.

By the way, how big was your last new hire class? Didn't they run it with a class of 1?

jgdeleon09

Can someone PM me the Spirit OAL jumpseater code for PSA, thanks.

Shiner

As an Envoy guy, let me try and shed some light on why a transfer to PSA is so unattractive.

When most of us joined Eagle, we were excited to be with this airline. It's not an easy interview and we felt we were joining a great airline. Then came the bankruptcy, the threats, the TA's, and now the shrinkage and overall negative work environment. While many here blame PSA, and have ill will towards the pilots, many more see AAG as the root cause of our demise.

Most Envoy pilots that are still here are disgusted with AAG and do not want to do anything to help them. We are simply biding our time, updating our apps, and looking for an upward move out. Those that wanted to make a sideways move are already gone. A move over to PSA, while it may pay more, would help AAG in the demise of Eagle.

Personally, I don't really hold a grudge against PSA pilots, what was our loss is your gain, but the pilots don't really control that. You were small, we were big. You had room to grow, we had room to shrink. None of the pilots control that. AAG does. Helping AAG with a move over to PSA is the last thing any of us wants to do.

I hope you can understand that and not take it personally. We want the airplanes here because it makes our airline more attractive and ends the shrinkage we've endured, and maybe this place turns around sooner. If they go, that's fine too, most of us here will be gone before all of the airplanes are, at least that's the hope.

sublime259

"This is a Pandora's box. IF such an effort is underway and IF ALPA, even at the PSA MEC level, is supporting it then they will be setting a precedent for the rinse and repeat business model that Parker is so fond of. A great example is the envoy and Piedmont ground handling.

ALPA supporting pilot poaching is fundamentally as dangerous as a B-scale, Norwegian Air or the Middle East Subsidies. Never again will a pilot be allowed to rise up a seniority list. Every time a seniority list gets top heavy the flying will just shift to another carrier and the new pilots will be lured in by the fast upgrade while yet another carrier dies. My guess is Parker himself proposed this idea, really its genius from his perspective.

For the record I have no faith in ALPA doing anything about this."

This was written on eaglelounge (our company forum) by someone and states perfectly why PSA targeting envoy pilots as street captains is a dangerous precedent. If all this is true (and I have no reason to believe otherwise) we can see that the PSA MEC hasn't changed it's tune. If any of you actually support this you make me absolutely sick.

FirstClass

I still do not understand what you are trying to say. Are you saying it would somehow be involuntary, that they would be told to leave or be fired? If experienced Envoy FO's decide to leave Envoy and become new hires at PSA, what's the problem? They'll upgrade quicker or come over as Captains faster then they ever could at Envoy. Then they can be on their way to wherever life takes them.

AboveAndBeyond

If the tinfoil hat fits....

PilotJ3

Meanwhile an envoy pilot that moves to PSA, yes he will be "CA faster", but with many FOs above him RSV will be long and hard.

Also anyone in the protected pilot group, will gave away their flow agreement, for what? Fly a 76seater at $62 hr? Also will lose seniority, specifically for JS purposes within the AA system. Also being at the bottom of the list means less furlough cushion.

Sorry, most of us have already 3 to 7 years here. I rather wait 2 more years and get paid $85 for flying at 145, than go back to PSA and get displaced to FO.

sublime259

Not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying it's wrong for the PSA MEC to actively poach pilots from envoy with the lure of a street captain position, all because your company or AAG or whoever bit off more than they can chew.

If they want to leave on their own accord, then that's their prerogative. However setting up a program with ALPA's support to poach pilots from another carrier is wrong, do you agree?

For the record I have no idea what agreement PSA's MEC was trying to push, but I can't see Cujo making this up just for the fun of it.

AboveAndBeyond

I think that is the exact point of all of this. You are being given a choice. If you want to move over and be a captain now, and then in 2 years down the road you have 1000+ PIC and are able to easily go to a major, then you can do that. If you want to stay at Envoy for another 2 years as a FO, you can do that too.

It is just an option. If there is any truth to this, you will have an option that many people do not get. If you don't want to take it, don't. If it is a better option for you, then take it.

Why would anyone complain about having options?