PSA info
04-08-2016, 10:03 AM
#2071
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2016
Posts: 417
Originally Posted by Crjreg007
What I'm getting at is you can trade 900s for 200s as we get 900s and not need an increase in pilots. Our staffing now can fly all the 900s were supposed to get if we park 200s. Throw bonuses at new hires so while we're parking 200s were gaining new hires and then we can slowly bring the 200s back on line. Also other airlines can pick up our routes. You think envoy or awac won't do our flying? Either way my original argument was that what we need is new hires. Giving money to our current group won't bring in new hires any more than offering them bonuses. Offering only new hires bonuses is cheaper for the company so I believe they will do that and not give current hires anything. Telling our pilot group to drop down and take less pay and to do things like picketing is only hurting us more. Every time you drop down the company needs to hire more so they give new hires more. Seems like you're the one coming out of that deal bad.
Most new hire pilots realize that once they are with an airline it is difficult to make a lateral move so they do their homework. They know that if they come to PSA they will get a 10k bonus (maybe 15) and the next year they will still be making less than first year at Endeavor or republic. They know that there is no more quick upgrade at PSA.
The biggest incentive to new hire pilots are; Bases, Pay, and Career progression, not necessarily in that order.
Bases: PSA has 1 commutable and nothing west of TYS, that eliminates nearly 2/3 of the country.
Career Progression: 4 upgrades so far this year, means you will not upgrade in 2 years at PSA. (probably not 3)
Pay: One of the lowest paying regionals with one of the worst contracts.
Any new hire pilot that does even a little bit of homework will realize that a 10k bonus is not worth 3 years of 2 leg commutes, inefficient lines, bullying schedulers, and low pay.
04-08-2016, 10:04 AM
#2072
Line Holder
Joined APC: Apr 2016
Posts: 31
Originally Posted by sweetholyjesus
What's happening is you're choosing to bend over and take it. Have fun with that.
If they can ask you to take concessions, you can ask for pay raises. A contract can be amended, you know.... You talk about leverage, well you have it. New hires can't run the whole airline. Better use it before more of your kind come only ne
If they can ask you to take concessions, you can ask for pay raises. A contract can be amended, you know.... You talk about leverage, well you have it. New hires can't run the whole airline. Better use it before more of your kind come only ne
04-08-2016, 10:09 AM
#2073
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,239
Originally Posted by SEPfield
You're implying new hire pilots are too stupid to figure out that after they get their bonus for the first year that they will still be at one of the lowest paid airlines their second year. Giving the pilots on property more money and a better contract is exactly what is need to attract new hires.
Most new hire pilots realize that once they are with an airline it is difficult to make a lateral move so they do their homework. They know that if they come to PSA they will get a 10k bonus (maybe 15) and the next year they will still be making less than first year at Endeavor or republic. They know that there is no more quick upgrade at PSA.
The biggest incentive to new hire pilots are; Bases, Pay, and Career progression, not necessarily in that order.
Bases: PSA has 1 commutable and nothing west of TYS, that eliminates nearly 2/3 of the country.
Career Progression: 4 upgrades so far this year, means you will not upgrade in 2 years at PSA. (probably not 3)
Pay: One of the lowest paying regionals with one of the worst contracts.
Any new hire pilot that does even a little bit of homework will realize that a 10k bonus is not worth 3 years of 2 leg commutes, inefficient lines, bullying schedulers, and low pay.
Most new hire pilots realize that once they are with an airline it is difficult to make a lateral move so they do their homework. They know that if they come to PSA they will get a 10k bonus (maybe 15) and the next year they will still be making less than first year at Endeavor or republic. They know that there is no more quick upgrade at PSA.
The biggest incentive to new hire pilots are; Bases, Pay, and Career progression, not necessarily in that order.
Bases: PSA has 1 commutable and nothing west of TYS, that eliminates nearly 2/3 of the country.
Career Progression: 4 upgrades so far this year, means you will not upgrade in 2 years at PSA. (probably not 3)
Pay: One of the lowest paying regionals with one of the worst contracts.
Any new hire pilot that does even a little bit of homework will realize that a 10k bonus is not worth 3 years of 2 leg commutes, inefficient lines, bullying schedulers, and low pay.
Actually I believe it has been 42. That class of thirty started in Jan rather than dec. then we had a class of 8 and then 4.
04-08-2016, 10:24 AM
#2074
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2016
Posts: 417
Originally Posted by JohnnyDingus
Actually I believe it has been 42. That class of thirty started in Jan rather than dec. then we had a class of 8 and then 4.
They had to make such big awards big awards in order to get the seniority low enough to pick up all the DECs. They didn't hire all us DECs based on staffing needs, but rather because they were trying to get as many Captains on property as possible before the 1 Jan snapshot for flow, and thats why we are somewhat overstaffed on Captains now.
Which is another trick they pulled. Envoys flow agreement was effective on the Date of Signing, PSAs was several months in the future.
04-08-2016, 10:27 AM
#2076
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2015
Posts: 857
Originally Posted by Crjreg007
Ok I'll ask you again. What leverage do we have and how do we use it to get better pay for captains and current FOs without the company just giving money to new hires. They can do that with out touching our contract.
04-08-2016, 10:27 AM
#2077
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,239
Originally Posted by SEPfield
The class of 30 and the class of 8 were primarily to award Captain Positions to DECs. I'm a DEC and was awarded on the 30 list, the junior guy in my class and the last class of DECs were all on the 8 list. Check the award to see how many awarded were listed as "New Hire"
They had to make such big awards big awards in order to get the seniority low enough to pick up all the DECs. They didn't hire all us DECs based on staffing needs, but rather because they were trying to get as many Captains on property as possible before the 1 Jan snapshot for flow, and thats why we are somewhat overstaffed on Captains now.
Which is another trick they pulled. Envoys flow agreement was effective on the Date of Signing, PSAs was several months in the future.
They had to make such big awards big awards in order to get the seniority low enough to pick up all the DECs. They didn't hire all us DECs based on staffing needs, but rather because they were trying to get as many Captains on property as possible before the 1 Jan snapshot for flow, and thats why we are somewhat overstaffed on Captains now.
Which is another trick they pulled. Envoys flow agreement was effective on the Date of Signing, PSAs was several months in the future.
Yeah but they aren't "active captains" until completing OE. So they will count towards the net 62.
04-08-2016, 12:08 PM
#2078
Line Holder
Joined APC: Apr 2016
Posts: 31
Originally Posted by SEPfield
The class of 30 and the class of 8 were primarily to award Captain Positions to DECs. I'm a DEC and was awarded on the 30 list, the junior guy in my class and the last class of DECs were all on the 8 list. Check the award to see how many awarded were listed as "New Hire"
They had to make such big awards big awards in order to get the seniority low enough to pick up all the DECs. They didn't hire all us DECs based on staffing needs, but rather because they were trying to get as many Captains on property as possible before the 1 Jan snapshot for flow, and thats why we are somewhat overstaffed on Captains now.
Which is another trick they pulled. Envoys flow agreement was effective on the Date of Signing, PSAs was several months in the future.
They had to make such big awards big awards in order to get the seniority low enough to pick up all the DECs. They didn't hire all us DECs based on staffing needs, but rather because they were trying to get as many Captains on property as possible before the 1 Jan snapshot for flow, and thats why we are somewhat overstaffed on Captains now.
Which is another trick they pulled. Envoys flow agreement was effective on the Date of Signing, PSAs was several months in the future.
04-08-2016, 12:10 PM
#2079
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,137
Originally Posted by Crjreg007
Once again not a company man just trying to tell our pilots you shouldn't drop down and give away money that you do have for money these senior guys think you will get. What are PSAs going to say while they picket. We signed in a **** contract and the company is paying us that and nothing more! We're outraged! Every one can shame me when I'm wrong but last time I checked what I'm saying is whats happening.
04-08-2016, 12:12 PM
#2080
Line Holder
Joined APC: Apr 2016
Posts: 31
Originally Posted by sweetholyjesus
This has been answered maybe 3 times. Call me an idiot but I think the only leverage pilots have and ever will have is labor. And during a pilot shortage I am shocked that you don't think you have leverage.
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