Yes flows come with baggage. But my point is if we manage to actually flow pilots up who give mainline a bad impression that will no doubt hurt us in possible future discussions on career progression (assuming this deal gets voided in arbitration)

 

It will have no effect whatsoever. Management only cares about the 35 RJs.

 

[QUOTE=Dogecoin;3240210]Sure, it could go to arbitration and end up going DALPAs way. They would strike a big win. It could also go to arbitration and go DLs way, and DALPA would get nothing.

OR before it goes to arbitration, they could negotiate, and get SOMETHING. Anything can happen with arbitration.

 

True, but Delta would be in an odd position to say, "we need to use force majeure to make a flow back because we accelerated the demise of the carrier to which there was flow back."

AA probably would have lasted a little longer if Delta didn't pull the plug so early. AA probably wasn't keen on using a carrier that potentially could be staffed almost entirely by Delta flow backs.

 

DALPA grievance has been filed officially. The actions to participate with scope relief by your MEC and pilot group will be remembered in the future.

 

Not our battle to fight.

 

Amen. Say it louder for the people in the back. Too many people don’t have a foundational knowledge of how mainline treats their pilots. They think it’s a free meal ticket with no strings attached. And that seems to be the sentiment of the edv union also. Unfortunate that the pilots of endeavor are being used as pawns. Nothing more nothing less. Damned if you do damned if you don’t. At the end of the day the only thing the pilots at edv have control over is themselves. Keep your apps updated and get yourself out of the whipsaw as soon as possible. Relying on a union to get you a job is one of the dumbest things going.

 

1st, if you think this is about your career progression and not 35 RJs just go jump off a cliff as you really need to be eliminated from the gene pool before you spread your affliction. Delta will hire and train as many pilots as quickly as it can, you don't need a flow agreement to get to mainline. In fact, unless you just stink at interviewing you'd probably get to mainline faster by skipping the flow and applying everywhere and taking the 1st job offered, just like you're probably doing now.

2nd, any Endeavor pilot who votes for this is shooting themselves in the foot unless it is their dream to be a lifelong Endeavor captain. Why would any pilot want to move good paying jobs from a mainline airline to McDonalds wages at a regional? Your goal is mainline, not Endeavor right? So why would you vote to steal mainline flying at mainline wages and put it at the regional with their wages? Maybe you could afford that $1200 PS5 on eBay THIS MONTH but long term you're simultaneously eating an exclusively sugar diet while smoking 4 packs of cigarettes a day.

Hopefully it is a moot point as I think management is out to lunch with their interpretation of the contract. The PWA clearly states a 4-party agreement is required to make changes and DALPA will NEVER agree to just name swap Endeavor for Compass. DAL will have to pay very dearly if they want those 35 jets if there's any hope for them at all.

 

9E guys, I apologize for posting here on your forum. But this is a mutual thing now between us.

Han love you like a brother. Spot on.

Myself and others at DAL probably don't care where Delta sources their new hires from. That is the companies business not ours.

What is our business is scope. And for those of you at 9E that want to come work at DAL, this should concern you. this is an in your face attack on our scope from the bottom end. We are already fighting the top end. I think we have at least 20 grievances on that side relating to our JV flying.

Scope is our life, Scope is our jobs, and yours if you want to come and work here. The more we give on it, the less positions for new hires to fill. You guys/gals want us to have rock solid scope protections in our contract. It benefits all of us in the long run. I was pleasantly surprised at the aggressiveness of our MEC in filing the grievance on this matter.

 

No one thinks this is just about career progression if they've read the TA. It is clearly tied to scope since the TA states that if 223 76 seat aircraft are not allowed to be flown by Delta that the agreement is invalid.

Career progression has been at the top of the list for our MEC for a long time, however a flow has not been what was sought. Some kind of merit based box checking possibly including the non-subjective parts of the DAL interview (like the JKT and COG tests) were part of previous proposals brought to Delta. As far as I know a straight flow was never even mentioned until this issue arose with the 35 76 seat RJs after Compass shut down.

Most likely this TA will never go to MEMRAT anyways even though it extends our contract and 90% of our pilot positions will be reserved for furloughed Delta pilots.