What’s the point of FLOW?
01-17-2021, 05:40 PM
#201
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2017
Position: 175 CA
Posts: 1,285
Originally Posted by LAXtoDEN
That’s now the 3rd time you’ve attempted to put words in my mouth. SkyWest management wants nothing to do with talks of our pilot group being unionized. They’re not scared of us, I never said that. But it’s in there best interest to make sure the pilots are happy, and currently we are. They start furloughing and asking for concessions the pilots won’t be so happy.
You can bet the likes of ALPA are waiting silently for an opportunity to rally the pilot group, and our management is aware.
Oh btw your management doesn’t seem to scared of you either, union or no union. While we’re calling back pilots sent home in training, you have men and women still on furlough.
You can bet the likes of ALPA are waiting silently for an opportunity to rally the pilot group, and our management is aware.
Oh btw your management doesn’t seem to scared of you either, union or no union. While we’re calling back pilots sent home in training, you have men and women still on furlough.
"We've never furloughed"
"we're calling back pilots sent home in training"
Those are mutually exclusive statements.
Your company furloughed and told you some BS koolaide story and you bought it. Just like the rest of your employer relationship.
01-17-2021, 05:49 PM
#202
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2021
Posts: 1,121
Originally Posted by Varsity
"We've never furloughed"
"we're calling back pilots sent home in training"
Those are mutually exclusive statements.
Your company furloughed and told you some BS koolaide story and you bought it. Just like the rest of your employer relationship.
"we're calling back pilots sent home in training"
Those are mutually exclusive statements.
Your company furloughed and told you some BS koolaide story and you bought it. Just like the rest of your employer relationship.
And btw your own union has a tendency to dance around as well. The reality is we’re all sipping on our own company’s koolaid. No doubt you still have pilots under the belief they’re 5.5 years away from flow.
Last edited by LAXtoDEN; 01-17-2021 at 06:17 PM.
01-17-2021, 06:19 PM
#203
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Joined APC: May 2017
Position: 175 CA
Posts: 1,285
Originally Posted by LAXtoDEN
I agree, there’s some truth to that. But there’s a big difference between line pilots being placed on zero pay with no benefits, and men and women who haven’t even taken a Checkride to earn their ATP certificate. Btw the new hires were still being paid, not a whole lot, but they were still receiving full coverage as well. I wouldn’t consider that a furlough, but not being fully compensated the monthly training guarantee of 65 hours should place it near the definition of a furlough.
And btw your own union has a tendency to dance around as well. The reality is we’re all sipping on our company’s own koolaid. No doubt you still have pilots under the belief they’re 5.5 years away from flow.
And btw your own union has a tendency to dance around as well. The reality is we’re all sipping on our company’s own koolaid. No doubt you still have pilots under the belief they’re 5.5 years away from flow.
Nobody at Envoy who remotely pays attention believes that. The MEC updates the pilots monthly with a seniority list spreadsheet of flow projections, most are around a decade.
01-17-2021, 06:36 PM
#204
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Joined APC: Jan 2021
Posts: 1,121
Originally Posted by Varsity
Nobody at Envoy who remotely pays attention believes that. The MEC updates the pilots monthly with a seniority list spreadsheet of flow projections, most are around a decade.
01-17-2021, 06:37 PM
#205
In a land of unicorns
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Whale FO
Posts: 6,476
Originally Posted by LAXtoDEN
That’s still a projection though. It’s not guaranteed, could be shorter, could be substantially longer than a decade. That’s really just a reminder from your MEC that “hey look we still got you a flow!”. Every airline has it’s own flavor of koolaid.
That's the biggest load of garbage I've heard in a VERY long time.
01-17-2021, 06:56 PM
#206
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Joined APC: Jan 2021
Posts: 1,121
Originally Posted by dera
Really? You are saying ENY MEC is trying to sell flow to the pilot group?
That's the biggest load of garbage I've heard in a VERY long time.
That's the biggest load of garbage I've heard in a VERY long time.
01-17-2021, 07:10 PM
#207
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Joined APC: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,510
Originally Posted by LAXtoDEN
Alright I’m getting tired of the back and forth, you have your opinion and I have mine. I live under the concept that everyone has an incentive. If your MEC is taking the time out of there day to send you monthly reminders of your projected flow time, there’s a reason.
01-17-2021, 07:13 PM
#208
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Joined APC: Jan 2021
Posts: 1,121
Originally Posted by pitchattitude
Yes, there is a reason, but actually quite the opposite of what you think. The seniority list is updated and provided so people know where they stand, for bidding or whatever, as well as know who has managed to make it out. The company seniority list is only officially updated twice a year. The “flow information” is a small part of what is on that list and if anything it’s a reminder of HOW LITTLE VALUE IT IS and an incentive to do anything else you can to get out.
01-17-2021, 07:29 PM
#209
In a land of unicorns
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Whale FO
Posts: 6,476
Originally Posted by LAXtoDEN
Alright I’m getting tired of the back and forth, you have your opinion and I have mine. I live under the concept that everyone has an incentive. If your MEC is taking the time out of there day to send you monthly reminders of your projected flow time, there’s a reason.
I know more about what our MEC thinks than you do, I can pretty much 110% guarantee that.
01-17-2021, 07:44 PM
#210
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Position: Semi-Retired...
Posts: 3,135
Originally Posted by LAXtoDEN
Alright I’m getting tired of the back and forth, you have your opinion and I have mine. I live under the concept that everyone has an incentive. If your MEC is taking the time out of there day to send you monthly reminders of your projected flow time, there’s a reason.
And to provide realistic seniority, equipment, base data to the pilots.
You’re throwing stones at Envoy while it sounds like you’ve already taken both concessions and furloughs. Nice job by the student council. Oh wait... anything they do is really nothing more than a suggestion.... which is why you have so many guys on zero time lines. Someday you’ll learn. At a regional, its Full pay to the last day.
For most, Don’t wait to flow. Get out of the regionals at your first opportunity. LCC, ACMI are both better options. The difference is night and day
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