FACTS:
- Pilots at Envoy flowing to AA right now have been here for 16+ years. When they started, they were told they would flow in less than 3 years. Sound familiar to Fatboy Wilsons claim of 2.5/6???
- The claim of 300 flows this year hasn't happened and will not happen. 127 to date and we are told less than the less than number can now be expected (sub 200). Not exactly ripping through flows are we? Hmmmmmm(see first bullet fact for reflection)
- New hires are getting the 175 and because it has been taken away from any current FO, except upgrade, it will, even if temporarily, create its own little world of fast quality of life movement. All the while, senior FOs are stuck on the 145, with little to no movement. While this may sound great to a potential new hire, it should be telling of how much management here cares about fairness and taking care of the FOs that have stayed the course even though many of their friends successfully moved to the PSAs and Mesas of the world and upgraded. What a great reward for 6-8 years of service. To put it plainly - this makes it obvious that once your nuts are in the envoy grinder, it will happen to you too.
- Artificial first year pay opens up to dismal second year pay. What industry do you get an almost 50% pay cut the second year? Again, all to get you "in the door". Then the pain begins.

This isn't a true fact, but a fairly wise summation based on my decades of experience: The only people on here that are cheerleading the company are doing it because they are management , Patsy's of, or interested in their own well being only. If I were interested in my own well being I should be on the other side, but I actually have a conscience and care for others.

 

The only hole I see in your argument is that you must be 55 to be fully vested and retire with all benefits.

Good for you playing the long game. You're not the only one.

 

If you're talking about me running " damage control" , sorry bro... I've been off since June 29 and will be back to work thursday. A whole week off without vacations. I've been posting here for long time, you can see my rants back and blah blah blah since 2010...

 

Well I stand corrected then. I believe it was 65 total with years of service + actual date. 44 + 21 yrs of service = 65

 

So you're saying your union leadership has no clue to what's going on there and their communique's are overblown misinformation, while people who claim all is really "calm" at Envoy have the true pulse of the pilots reality ?

It would appear most of the bashing is coming from inside Envoy like present pilots and even the union leadership, so perhaps you should direct your frustrations to where they should more aptly be ?

 

Ah, now I understand why you see things as very calm.

 

Maybe because I have a life.

No time for you today old man, today is awesome outside... you want me to bring you some Ensure and your walker so you can enjoy it too?

 

Of course someone would say such positive things without having to sacrifice their profession. Hell, I would probably be just as positive as you if I got $$$ just for being hired and retain my services.

But nope, I'm just a 9-year captain, who is forced to commute on reserve, and is too expensive. Company would be grateful to see my butt out the door. (Sad to say, probably every other pilot below me on the list.)

It's amazing when you actually get to be in the shoes of your peers. I completely understand now why my captains I flew with were so grumpy and distraught. This corporation is clearly set on one thing, and it's not safety. Everything that comes out of corp leaders is complete hypocrisy. That's why I can not trust anything they project, say, promise, teach, or preach. If they gripe about a captain focusing on conducting a safe flight around wx and preflight the AML throughly, and gripe about the delay you took to do it professionally? Then there are serious issues in play here.

 

Again, I'm a relatively new pilot to the company so I don't know how you guys were treated during the bankruptcy. It sucks you have to commute. I did it for a while and ended up moving. To say that most of the people I fly with are grumpy would be lying. Most of the captains I fly with are actually nice and have a positive outlook. There are the grumpy ones but that is very rare. And I do fly with a bunch of senior guys.

 

-The upgrade is 8 years and increasing.
-Flow is negligible/ nearly non-existent and irrelevant.
-Pay is a joke with no improvements in sight.
-Culture and morale is punitive and toxic.
-QOL/contractual violations/reserve are horrible.
-Schedules are terrible and inefficient.

FOs continue to head for the door as the company does nothing to make it worth hanging around until "flow."