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12-24-2016, 07:00 AM
#2241
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2012
Posts: 988
Originally Posted by Softpayman
From a pilot perspective of course we'd like a 14hr capable plane to fly the 6-8hr flights from the East coast to Western Europe.
I'm not sure how cargo fits into the equation...Especially for narrow body aircraft not capable of fitting containers. Continental (later United) and USAir clearly used narrow bodies to a great extent out of EWR/PHL throughout Ireland/UK/France.
The annoyance of the occasional fuel stop is weighted into any decision. Do you want a plane that needs an occasional fuel stop or one that becomes a huge financial anchor if a region becomes a huge money loser. Well, we have ten A350s ($250million each) and since Europe market is shrinking and Brazil is in a depression we'll be deploying them on JFK-MCO.
I'm not sure how cargo fits into the equation...Especially for narrow body aircraft not capable of fitting containers. Continental (later United) and USAir clearly used narrow bodies to a great extent out of EWR/PHL throughout Ireland/UK/France.
The annoyance of the occasional fuel stop is weighted into any decision. Do you want a plane that needs an occasional fuel stop or one that becomes a huge financial anchor if a region becomes a huge money loser. Well, we have ten A350s ($250million each) and since Europe market is shrinking and Brazil is in a depression we'll be deploying them on JFK-MCO.
Cargo wouldn't fit into the equation if we did Europe with narrow bodies IMO.....
Like I said earlier, go big or not at all.....if you half-a$$ this, that's when you get in trouble....once we get the narrow body fleet to the level that could feed a Europe flight schedule, I think you need to go with wide bodies...if the market stays depressed, use them to go south....South American is one of the fastest growing air travel market....
Is it a risk? Of course. Everything in this industry is. But I think there's a reason our CFO "Decided to go spend more time with his family". Robin wanted the last and most vocal barrier to larger fleet out of the way to further his vision of where he wants JB to be/go in the next 5-10 years.
12-24-2016, 08:33 AM
#2243
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Position: CA
Posts: 1,211
Originally Posted by JustAnotherPLT
We should hand back the aircraft we have now and let someone who knows what they are doing operate them. Adding anything transatlantic is going to be a joke.
The planes will be 90% full, make money and you'd still moan if a plane runs late and say it's a failure.
12-24-2016, 08:44 AM
#2244
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Position: CA
Posts: 1,211
Originally Posted by BunkerF16
I'm not sure it would be an "occasional" fuel stop....probably the norm and the non-stop would be the exception.....
Like I said earlier, go big or not at all.....if you half-a$$ this, that's when you get in trouble....once we get the narrow body fleet to the level that could feed a Europe flight schedule, I think you need to go with wide bodies...if the market stays depressed, use them to go south....South American is one of the fastest growing air travel market....
Is it a risk? Of course. Everything in this industry is. But I think there's a reason our CFO "Decided to go spend more time with his family". Robin wanted the last and most vocal barrier to larger fleet out of the way to further his vision of where he wants JB to be/go in the next 5-10 years.
Like I said earlier, go big or not at all.....if you half-a$$ this, that's when you get in trouble....once we get the narrow body fleet to the level that could feed a Europe flight schedule, I think you need to go with wide bodies...if the market stays depressed, use them to go south....South American is one of the fastest growing air travel market....
Is it a risk? Of course. Everything in this industry is. But I think there's a reason our CFO "Decided to go spend more time with his family". Robin wanted the last and most vocal barrier to larger fleet out of the way to further his vision of where he wants JB to be/go in the next 5-10 years.
We'd be running them out of BOS/JFK while American has them even further South in PHL. They don't normally stop for fuel. Some of the further routes on occasion did (Oslo) but certainly over the year this was the exception, definitely not the norm.
All 757 service by American....
BOS-CDG
JFK-BHX
JFK-CDG
JFK-DUB
JFK-EDI
JFK-MAN
ORD-MAN
PHL-AMS
PHL-BRU
PHL-GLA
PHL-LIS
PHL-SNN
United (or Continental's) 757 included Madrid, Shannon, Stockholm, Stuttgart, Paris, Oslo, Dublin, Edinburgh, Belfast, Barcelona, Lisbon, Berlin, Manchester, Amsterdam, Hamburg, Glasgow and Birmingham.
12-24-2016, 03:46 PM
#2247
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Right Seat 737, Front seat T-6
Posts: 536
Originally Posted by Tom a Hawk
Nope. Filler.
Not trying to rain on anyone's parade at all, but just to let you know if JB goes to Europe, I think the earliest would be a couple of years from applying ... but I am asking a buddy who was here at the time and will let y'all know if you care.
Might help to focus your CBA negotiations rather than holding out hope for growth to Europe? Just thinking out loud ....
Last edited by F15Cricket; 12-24-2016 at 04:00 PM.
12-24-2016, 05:39 PM
#2248
Not A Janitor
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Posts: 814
Originally Posted by F15Cricket
Might help to focus your CBA negotiations rather than holding out hope for growth to Europe? Just thinking out loud ....
12-24-2016, 05:43 PM
#2249
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Position: Captain
Posts: 242
Originally Posted by Softpayman
I think it's pretty safe to say that they will. Why wouldn't you?
.
.
12-24-2016, 06:33 PM
#2250
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: 1Durrty5
Posts: 290
Originally Posted by F15Cricket
Ok, thanks. I am not sure of the details (we added ETOPS prior to my time here), but adding ETOPS capabilities take awhile --pilots and mechanics trained, aircraft certified, procedures in place, etc. I think one of the reasons SWA has not yet added ETOPS is the maintainance tracking / history.
Not trying to rain on anyone's parade at all, but just to let you know if JB goes to Europe, I think the earliest would be a couple of years from applying ... but I am asking a buddy who was here at the time and will let y'all know if you care.
Might help to focus your CBA negotiations rather than holding out hope for growth to Europe? Just thinking out loud ....
Not trying to rain on anyone's parade at all, but just to let you know if JB goes to Europe, I think the earliest would be a couple of years from applying ... but I am asking a buddy who was here at the time and will let y'all know if you care.
Might help to focus your CBA negotiations rather than holding out hope for growth to Europe? Just thinking out loud ....
Frankly, most Jetblue pilots couldn't care less. When the operation falls apart after one morning of snow and freezing rain, there's bigger problems. When there's no market rate CBA that values the pilot group, there's bigger problems.
It's entertaining to speculate about flying to Europe on here because it's something management has mentioned. That's part of the fun of an internet forum. Don't confuse that for a lack of focus or commitment towards fighting for the best CBA we can get.
Not to rain on your parade, but perhaps it would help to focus on your JCBA negotiations now that the merger is finalized. It sounds like Tilden is giving you more of a fight than you're used to. Whichever group ratifies a CBA first will have a significant impact on the other pilot group's negotiations.
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