PSA can downgrade DECs if they decide to. I am a DEC

We were not hired as Captains technically. We were hired as FOs that had the experience and seniority to hold a captain position prior to completing training. Normally the company would have to train us as FOs and then put us right back in to upgrade training. The deal with the union basically bypassed the initial FO training, which saved the company time and money. It is also why we were paid as FOs until we passed our PC, or "completed our upgrade".

So if the company does decide they need to downgrade they will do it according to the contract and in reverse seniority order. I.e. Most junior captain (most likely a DEC) will be the first downgrade. That also means the upgrades will then happen in seniority order, so all the FOs that didn't have their 1000 when we were hired as DECs will most likely upgrade before we re-upgrade. Putting us at the bottom of what is quickly becoming a 3 year + upgrade.

However since as DECs we never went through the PSA training to fly in the right seat, we are not qualified to fly in the right seat. The company will either have to put us through the full FO training program or come up with a condensed training program which will require FAA approval.

I don't think the company wants to go through the trouble and cost to attempt downgrading the DECs, when there really aren't that many of us anyway. Also considering that we all left 1 airline already for a DEC position, they can safely assume we have no problem leaving PSA for another DEC postion.

Personally I will be in a new hire class at another airline before I am in a downgrade class at PSA. I'm not saying I'm too good to be an FO again, I would gladly swing gear for any of the FOs I've flown with at PSA so far. I'm just saying I'm not going to be an FO for PSA, there's too many other airlines with better pay, better contracts, and better bases.

 

Why all this talk of downgrades? You guys do realize how completely implausible that is right now correct?

 

I'm not bothered over the 20k that was left on the table for nothing. It's the issues that's going to come as a result of that. There hasn't been announcement of upgrade yet. Next, their probably going to mess with the flow. Why are you people OK with this possibility?

 

You do realize that the company's last offer was not intended to help the poor, lowly, underpaid F/O's, right? In case you were confused on the issue, the company was offering more money to help THEMSELVES!!!!! Not you!

The company needed to do something to help THEMSELVES attract more pilots. They made what they thought was an offer that would be accepted by the current group but would, more importantly, help THEMSELVES! When that offer was declined, they again did something that they thought would help THEMSELVES attract more pilots - they upped the signing bonus to $10,000/$15,000.

By quashing upgrades and flow, they are simply going to hurt themselves! They're not going to do that! PSA still has 2-3 new airplanes arriving every month and they still need to attract, (and dare I suggest "RETAIN") pilots to fly those airplanes!

Chill! Patience. We're still in a pretty good position to gain some contractual improvements.

 

How long are you willing to wait? What makes you think they'll even entertain the idea of increasing the flow (I understand you didn't mention it, but I will). I highly doubt they'll want to do any contract gains come June. I hope I'm wrong.

 

How long am I willing to wait? I have no timeline. It's not up to me. It's up to Dougie. How long does HE want to wait? How long will it take HIM to realize that his gimmicks are not going to bring in the number of pilots that HE needs? How long is he going to let Delta build and reinforce their regional feed while his regional feed atrophies?

It's up to Dougie as to whether or not his wholey-owned regionals survive. He can either improve his labor contracts and make them attractive to the few new hire candidates that remain or he can leave the PSA, Envoy, and Piedmont contracts in place and his wholey-owned regionals will wither on the vine.

As for flow, it's not going to increase. If anyone came here for the flow, they're fools.

 

Last month our seniority list shrunk for the first time in years. Both CA & FOs are leaving. If something isn't done soon to add more FOs we will be downgrading CAs to cover the flying.

 

Our seniority list has been shrinking for a year now


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You sure about that. Our bottom number has dropped a ton over a thousand, from like 3200 to 1900

 

I don't think you know what you're talking about. You're just spouting rhetoric. There will be no need to downgrade CAs (which the company won't do because that would basically spell disaster for recruiting). They will flow and let attrition do its job before they downgrade. It just doesn't make any sense.

So many of you have turned into complete alarmist about PSA. Nothing much has really changed. It was pretty obvious months ago (when they stopped running FO classes, really) that continued growth would be difficult. Put down the Internet and go enjoy your life. Things will improve here, it's just going to take things getting worse for the company to shell out the money to improve it.