Spirit of NKS
#7411
I agree that first year pay is too low. And on the next contract, I would expect to see that number higher for first year. Some would argue that the company needs to raise that number on their own, to attract higher quality candidates when Legacy carriers start hiring more and the promise of a "quick upgrade" is gone from Spirit. Some would argue that, if necessary, the negotiating committee needs to raise the pay regardless of what the company intends to do with it. I simply feel it needs to be addressed, regardless, and it needs to be raised. Some may not care about those who are not on property yet, I feel it is the right thing to help lay a better path for those who come after us. Easy to say "pay your dues," sounds like a poor excuse to me. With the exception of a few lucky Riddle pilots, every pilot on the Spirit list has paid their dues in this career, one way or another.
If the same guys negotiate the next contract, that doesnt mean that things will remain the same. The make up of the pilot group is different now. When we reach a new TA, whenever that will be, pilots hired after 2010 will be in the majority and they will be the ones with the largest voice and influence with the next contract. I do not know if many of the senior pilots here realize that, but it is a fact. This next contract will need to be constructed to address many of the issues that mid level seniority pilots deal with in order for any TA to pass. A "B scale" isnt going to pass this time. Maybe many of these post 2010 hires will remember how much first year pay sucks and wont vote for a contract that doesnt address that.
Im betting $50 that you're a FLL pilot? Am I correct with this assumption?
#7412
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2014
Position: A320 Left
Posts: 715
That doesn't even make sense. The contract of $38.50 and hour was negotiated by and aided by ALPA National, ALPA lawyers, ALPA financial analysis departments, approved by an ALPA MEC and approved by ALPA pilots. If you feel it to be a disgrace, it would solely be a disgrace to ALPA, by ALPA.
I agree that first year pay is too low. And on the next contract, I would expect to see that number higher for first year. Some would argue that the company needs to raise that number on their own, to attract higher quality candidates when Legacy carriers start hiring more and the promise of a "quick upgrade" is gone from Spirit. Some would argue that, if necessary, the negotiating committee needs to raise the pay regardless of what the company intends to do with it. I simply feel it needs to be addressed, regardless, and it needs to be raised. Some may not care about those who are not on property yet, I feel it is the right thing to help lay a better path for those who come after us. Easy to say "pay your dues," sounds like a poor excuse to me. With the exception of a few lucky Riddle pilots, every pilot on the Spirit list has paid their dues in this career, one way or another.
If the same guys negotiate the next contract, that doesnt mean that things will remain the same. The make up of the pilot group is different now. When we reach a new TA, whenever that will be, pilots hired after 2010 will be in the majority and they will be the ones with the largest voice and influence with the next contract. I do not know if many of the senior pilots here realize that, but it is a fact. This next contract will need to be constructed to address many of the issues that mid level seniority pilots deal with in order for any TA to pass. A "B scale" isnt going to pass this time. Maybe many of these post 2010 hires will remember how much first year pay sucks and wont vote for a contract that doesnt address that.
Im betting $50 that you're a FLL pilot? Am I correct with this assumption?
I agree that first year pay is too low. And on the next contract, I would expect to see that number higher for first year. Some would argue that the company needs to raise that number on their own, to attract higher quality candidates when Legacy carriers start hiring more and the promise of a "quick upgrade" is gone from Spirit. Some would argue that, if necessary, the negotiating committee needs to raise the pay regardless of what the company intends to do with it. I simply feel it needs to be addressed, regardless, and it needs to be raised. Some may not care about those who are not on property yet, I feel it is the right thing to help lay a better path for those who come after us. Easy to say "pay your dues," sounds like a poor excuse to me. With the exception of a few lucky Riddle pilots, every pilot on the Spirit list has paid their dues in this career, one way or another.
If the same guys negotiate the next contract, that doesnt mean that things will remain the same. The make up of the pilot group is different now. When we reach a new TA, whenever that will be, pilots hired after 2010 will be in the majority and they will be the ones with the largest voice and influence with the next contract. I do not know if many of the senior pilots here realize that, but it is a fact. This next contract will need to be constructed to address many of the issues that mid level seniority pilots deal with in order for any TA to pass. A "B scale" isnt going to pass this time. Maybe many of these post 2010 hires will remember how much first year pay sucks and wont vote for a contract that doesnt address that.
Im betting $50 that you're a FLL pilot? Am I correct with this assumption?
#7413
I don't know. Spirit at the moment is not having trouble finding good qualified pilots so I doubt it is high on the priority list.
Food for thought: How many Spirit pilots are forced to pick up a lot of extra flying in their first year just to make ends meet? When all the first year guys are sitting on flica like birds of prey, it makes it more difficult for the rest of the pilots to pick up open trips and make more $$. Is it possible that raising first year pay may actually increase the average yearly compensation of first officers beyond 1st year pay?
Food for thought: How many Spirit pilots are forced to pick up a lot of extra flying in their first year just to make ends meet? When all the first year guys are sitting on flica like birds of prey, it makes it more difficult for the rest of the pilots to pick up open trips and make more $$. Is it possible that raising first year pay may actually increase the average yearly compensation of first officers beyond 1st year pay?
#7414
As a family man and a commuter, I end up pretty close to guarantee each month.
Those curious about junior bases and line holding: there's so much movement and hiring now that it's hard to predict on the FO side. I held a line in FLL first month, relief in DTW the second month, relief in ORD the third month, and relief in DFW the fourth month. My friends that made it to LAS spent 6 months or so on reserve. Your mileage will vary.
#7415
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 669
What's the latest on hiring? Have not heard much on that subject in awhile.
#7416
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 279
Yeah first year pay sucks!! You can thank your union for only being able to credit your line value.. You name it, red/green, JRM police, or 29 hour enforcement.. All of it has prevented making more money.. I grossed 45k my first year in 2012 as a commuter and I hustled... All of that came to a screaching hault in November, 2012.. Thanks union!
#7418
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 669
I'm sure I'll be asking the same question a year from now!!! Been trying to get hired for the past year and a half! Don't know the secret handshake!
#7419
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2014
Position: A320 Left
Posts: 715
Yeah first year pay sucks!! You can thank your union for only being able to credit your line value.. You name it, red/green, JRM police, or 29 hour enforcement.. All of it has prevented making more money.. I grossed 45k my first year in 2012 as a commuter and I hustled... All of that came to a screaching hault in November, 2012.. Thanks union!
#7420
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 279
Red/green and the 29 hour cap lay solely at the feet of management. Your frustration is misdirected if you blame the union for those issues. Unless of course you attribute the red/green fiasco to the removal of certain management pilots from our seniority list. That had to happen by the way.
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