Reserve for Dummies
11-25-2024 | 09:47 AM
#2401
Moderator
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 8,341
Likes: 1,347
This is the point CX500T and I are trying to get across with this issue: PWA 23.9.b.2.b
In short, if using the 2 hour provision, CS can still award a rotation as early as 2 hours from the start of the SC period. I can't be sitting at home waiting to call CS to switch my contactable status or check my schedule on iCrew for the first at SC +2:01.
Yes, I totally understand that under the provision, a pilot cannot be assigned a trip in the first two hours. There is more to it than that though.
In short, if using the 2 hour provision, CS can still award a rotation as early as 2 hours from the start of the SC period. I can't be sitting at home waiting to call CS to switch my contactable status or check my schedule on iCrew for the first at SC +2:01.
Yes, I totally understand that under the provision, a pilot cannot be assigned a trip in the first two hours. There is more to it than that though.
If they assign that trip 1 second before SC even starts, you still have 2 hours to get there. If you check your schedule in iCrew (or call CS) 2 seconds later, you now have 2+ hours, because it instantly returns you to “promptly available”, AND they must now call you for legal notification. You aren’t waiting until SC+2:01 to accomplish that. 23.S.9.b.2.b is irrelevant in this scenario.
Again, there is literally zero downside, and the only risk is failing to check your schedule 1 second into your Original SC start. If you do that, it’s a no risk exercise.
Last edited by FangsF15; 11-25-2024 at 09:59 AM.
11-25-2024 | 09:50 AM
#2402
Racketeer
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 13,339
Likes: 829
From: N60.4858 W149.9327
Go look at the trip coverage ladder for rotations less than 18 hrs out. VAS is below short call pilots. VAS is not going to save any short call pilot from getting called. It can only be used to cover reroutes. I did 3 of them earlier this year. Pretty good deal with a very low probability of getting called.
11-25-2024 | 10:03 AM
#2403
Racketeer
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 13,339
Likes: 829
From: N60.4858 W149.9327
This is the point CX500T and I are trying to get across with this issue: PWA 23.9.b.2.b
In short, if using the 2 hour provision, CS can still award a rotation as early as 2 hours from the start of the SC period. I can't be sitting at home waiting to call CS to switch my contactable status or check my schedule on iCrew for the first at SC +2:01.
Yes, I totally understand that under the provision, a pilot cannot be assigned a trip in the first two hours. There is more to it than that though.
In short, if using the 2 hour provision, CS can still award a rotation as early as 2 hours from the start of the SC period. I can't be sitting at home waiting to call CS to switch my contactable status or check my schedule on iCrew for the first at SC +2:01.
Yes, I totally understand that under the provision, a pilot cannot be assigned a trip in the first two hours. There is more to it than that though.
1) call when assigned SC to be NC
2) set phone alarm for when SC begins
3) check Micrew for trips at SC start time (there will not be an assignment on your schedule but if there is start your 2ish hour report process and disregard #4)
4) check icrew (you now are on normal SC call out "promptly available.")
Do not acknowledge anything in Micrew or icrew, just check. They will call you after the 2 hours when you are contactable or after the icrew schedule check.
Last edited by notEnuf; 11-25-2024 at 10:27 AM.
11-25-2024 | 10:08 AM
#2404
Line Holder
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 919
Likes: 297
The non-contactable is retractable. You get that, right?
If they assign that trip 1 second before SC even starts, you still have 2 hours to get there. If you check your schedule in iCrew (or call CS) 2 seconds later, you now have 2+ hours, because it instantly returns you to “promptly available”, AND they must now call you for legal notification. You aren’t waiting until SC+2:01 to accomplish that. 23.S.9.b.2.b is irrelevant in this scenario.
Again, there is literally zero downside, and the only risk is failing to check your schedule 1 second into your Original SC start. If you do that, it’s a no risk exercise.
If they assign that trip 1 second before SC even starts, you still have 2 hours to get there. If you check your schedule in iCrew (or call CS) 2 seconds later, you now have 2+ hours, because it instantly returns you to “promptly available”, AND they must now call you for legal notification. You aren’t waiting until SC+2:01 to accomplish that. 23.S.9.b.2.b is irrelevant in this scenario.
Again, there is literally zero downside, and the only risk is failing to check your schedule 1 second into your Original SC start. If you do that, it’s a no risk exercise.
11-25-2024 | 10:11 AM
#2405
Racketeer
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 13,339
Likes: 829
From: N60.4858 W149.9327
I understand how it works, I just don't see the value in it. Whether you use the non-contactable or not, they could still put a trip on your schedule that reports 1 minute after your SC starts. You still have roughly two hours to get there whether you told them NC or not.
11-25-2024 | 10:14 AM
#2406
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 1,189
Likes: 322
The non-contactable is retractable. You get that, right?
If they assign that trip 1 second before SC even starts, you still have 2 hours to get there. If you check your schedule in iCrew (or call CS) 2 seconds later, you now have 2+ hours, because it instantly returns you to “promptly available”, AND they must now call you for legal notification. You aren’t waiting until SC+2:01 to accomplish that. 23.S.9.b.2.b is irrelevant in this scenario.
Again, there is literally zero downside, and the only risk is failing to check your schedule 1 second into your Original SC start. If you do that, it’s a no risk exercise.
If they assign that trip 1 second before SC even starts, you still have 2 hours to get there. If you check your schedule in iCrew (or call CS) 2 seconds later, you now have 2+ hours, because it instantly returns you to “promptly available”, AND they must now call you for legal notification. You aren’t waiting until SC+2:01 to accomplish that. 23.S.9.b.2.b is irrelevant in this scenario.
Again, there is literally zero downside, and the only risk is failing to check your schedule 1 second into your Original SC start. If you do that, it’s a no risk exercise.
11-25-2024 | 10:28 AM
#2407
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 525
Likes: 25
From: 320
Getting more confused. So wouldn't this 1-minute into your SC sked check return you to promptly available like the NC window never existed? (The green auto-save prompt is brutal today btw)
And doesn't this stuff hinge on the CS'er you talk to even knowing what any of this means? Some guy a few pages back said his CS'er basically never heard of it. Doesn't mean that makes this provision not exist or that it's our problem in the moment, but still......
And doesn't this stuff hinge on the CS'er you talk to even knowing what any of this means? Some guy a few pages back said his CS'er basically never heard of it. Doesn't mean that makes this provision not exist or that it's our problem in the moment, but still......
11-25-2024 | 10:29 AM
#2408
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,406
Likes: 499
So, I always thought the NC was for commuters who would say something like “hey I know my SC starts at noon, but my second flight lands at 1:59pm, but I’ll be at the airport if you want to give me a showtime at 2pm while airborn.” The implication is that buddy will be pulling up to an adjacent gate to where his assigned 2pm trip leaves from.
if you’re a local and you call them and tell them you’re NC and the same thing happens, you’re saying you could get that same 2pm report time and be like “I’ll be there in a reasonable time (4pm)” when they call you at 2pm after your NC period?
Just trying to understand, I’m local and like CX500, I’ve always just left my house at the start of my SC when they call. even if they gave me something with an unreasonable report time. (Im also 1hr Newark, 2-3 hours JFK)
if you’re a local and you call them and tell them you’re NC and the same thing happens, you’re saying you could get that same 2pm report time and be like “I’ll be there in a reasonable time (4pm)” when they call you at 2pm after your NC period?
Just trying to understand, I’m local and like CX500, I’ve always just left my house at the start of my SC when they call. even if they gave me something with an unreasonable report time. (Im also 1hr Newark, 2-3 hours JFK)
11-25-2024 | 10:30 AM
#2409
Can’t find crew pickup
Joined: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,059
Likes: 200
That’s not the reason VAS is not currently being used.
This provision has nothing to do with that either since we have multiple, overlapping SC periods.
I’ve been called on SC with a report in 45 min. Flat out told them I can’t make it and would be there in approximately 2 hours. 15 min after the original report time, I got two calls from CS asking where I was and I even had the captain call me from the cockpit wondering where I was!
So yeah, we even have pilots pushing other pilots on report times.
You’re free to use PWA provisions to your advantage but they are not all the same depending on your situation.
This provision has nothing to do with that either since we have multiple, overlapping SC periods.
I’ve been called on SC with a report in 45 min. Flat out told them I can’t make it and would be there in approximately 2 hours. 15 min after the original report time, I got two calls from CS asking where I was and I even had the captain call me from the cockpit wondering where I was!
So yeah, we even have pilots pushing other pilots on report times.
You’re free to use PWA provisions to your advantage but they are not all the same depending on your situation.
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