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Old 07-01-2016, 05:34 AM
  #3571  
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Originally Posted by go skers View Post
There's no requirement to request three different days.
That's weird. There's was a requirement to select three different days when I was there. I just quit in April.
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Old 07-01-2016, 05:38 AM
  #3572  
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Originally Posted by Jack03 View Post
That's weird. There's was a requirement to select three different days when I was there. I just quit in April.
Congrats on getting out!
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Old 07-01-2016, 05:41 AM
  #3573  
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Originally Posted by ag386 View Post
Congrats on getting out!
Still can't answer the question huh?
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Old 07-01-2016, 06:16 AM
  #3574  
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Originally Posted by eaglefly View Post
If you're going to Envoy with your eyes open understanding the upgrade and flow projections aren't supported by the facts including attraction/attrition, that's good. This is a pilots forum though where pilots discuss/debate the good, bad and ugly, so if the reality of that is too annoying and you prefer only to hear harps and mandolins, this arena is probably not for you.
Personally, though I don't think you'll be escaping "negativity" by vacating this forum, as from most accounts, you'll deal with it on a day-to-day basis once you do get to Envoy (like all regionals). Regionals aren't happy places as you yourself acknowledge, so prepare to exist in an unhappy environment.

Good luck.

Firstly, thanks for the reply, secondly I do go into every situation with my eyes wide open.


Here's the thing what I feel like people are failing to realize.

I feel as though honestly folks coming into the regionals are like cattle that are being put through the slaughterhouse.

Just as there are flight schools out there knowing they will have a pipeline of flight instructors leaving as soon as they meet required minimums, the regionals know this as well.

Sure they can dangle the carrot above our heads with bonus's they can offer incentives here and there, but they also undoubtedly know that we have bigger career plans than being a lifer at a regional.

Why not your next move be your best move? Yes fight for what you think is a fair pay, yes fight for what is right, by all means do it, but in the same breath- get in, get out, and get paid. Aviation is about career advancement.

I mean if your goal is to fly mainline, by all means go for it, but as I had said previously, have that back up or that spade to rely on in case things don't go as planned.

I'm not trying to escape the negativity, most of what's written on this forum goes beyond negativity. It's moreso a dumpster of ****ed off individuals that I'd LIKE to call human-beings but forget on how to act like humans.

Too much mudslinging, bickering, huffing and buffing.

I'm all for a great debate hearing that bad, that good and everything inbetween but boy, over the years this website seems like a scene out of the movie "Idiocracy" (And once again, I'm not perfect)

I don't need the fancy violins, and cherubs feeding me grapes lol. But I think we all know we could be handling ourselves a little bit better around here.
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Old 07-01-2016, 06:21 AM
  #3575  
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Originally Posted by AcesHigh View Post
Firstly, thanks for the reply, secondly I do go into every situation with my eyes wide open.


Here's the thing what I feel like people are failing to realize.

I feel as though honestly folks coming into the regionals are like cattle that are being put through the slaughterhouse.

Just as there are flight schools out there knowing they will have a pipeline of flight instructors leaving as soon as they meet required minimums, the regionals know this as well.

Sure they can dangle the carrot above our heads with bonus's they can offer incentives here and there, but they also undoubtedly know that we have bigger career plans than being a lifer at a regional.

Why not your next move be your best move? Yes fight for what you think is a fair pay, yes fight for what is right, by all means do it, but in the same breath- get in, get out, and get paid. Aviation is about career advancement.

I mean if your goal is to fly mainline, by all means go for it, but as I had said previously, have that back up or that spade to rely on in case things don't go as planned.

I'm not trying to escape the negativity, most of what's written on this forum goes beyond negativity. It's moreso a dumpster of ****ed off individuals that I'd LIKE to call human-beings but forget on how to act like humans.

Too much mudslinging, bickering, huffing and buffing.

I'm all for a great debate hearing that bad, that good and everything inbetween but boy, over the years this website seems like a scene out of the movie "Idiocracy" (And once again, I'm not perfect)

I don't need the fancy violins, and cherubs feeding me grapes lol. But I think we all know we could be handling ourselves a little bit better around here.
I hear what your saying, but airline pilots will always be airline pilots and it's in our nature to be combative to each other. After all, ghat's a major reason why this profession has descended to where it has gotten.
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Old 07-01-2016, 06:23 AM
  #3576  
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Originally Posted by SkyWago View Post
Aces, good for you!

Gotta at least try to see the trees through all this sleaze running around here on the internet.

Yea man, people are letting the things in life dictate how life will go for them when they forget they have the control to make life work best for them.

Sure things don't happen overnight, it takes time, a heck of a lot of patience, but with some determination and being proactive with what you want to do in life anything is possible!

That's all I'm saying!
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Old 07-01-2016, 06:30 AM
  #3577  
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Originally Posted by eaglefly View Post
I hear what your saying, but airline pilots will always be airline pilots and it's in our nature to be combative to each other. After all, ghat's a major reason why this profession has descended to where it has gotten.
I hear you man, but it's foolish to be "combatative" in the scheme of things when we all essentially play for the same team.

Yes some shiesty things behind closed doors, yes carriers lose routes to other carriers, it can be VERY hostile environment, but it doesn't need to be.

I'd rather see how we as a pilot group can be together and work for eachother than be against eachother....

Hell, I sound like a hippie.

Negativity breeds negativity...You folks would be stupid if you think a little positivity and unification wouldn't help to turn things around on this forum, better yet this industry.
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:09 AM
  #3578  
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Originally Posted by eaglefly View Post
If you're going to Envoy with your eyes open understanding the upgrade and flow projections aren't supported by the facts including attraction/attrition, that's good. This is a pilots forum though where pilots discuss/debate the good, bad and ugly, so if the reality of that is too annoying and you prefer only to hear harps and mandolins, this arena is probably not for you. Personally, though I don't think you'll be escaping "negativity" by vacating this forum, as from most accounts, you'll deal with it on a day-to-day basis once you do get to Envoy (like all regionals). Regionals aren't happy places as you yourself acknowledge, so prepare to exist in an unhappy environment.

Good luck.
I know ace he'll be fine.

I've been at envoy for 6 years, through all the he ll years. At this point things have returned back to a more normal place. Eagle or envoy have never been a bad place to work, even now. Yes it sucks for awhile when management touches things and shakes the hive. Yes management needs to fix the schedules and throw some kind of cash to short term recruit to fix the upgrade time. However that's it, you fix those two and maybe open back up a baseor two and we will be right back on level with endeavour and skywest. It's really frustrating because we are such an easy few decisions and costs from being a great place again. Hopefully management wakes up.
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:33 AM
  #3579  
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Originally Posted by lakehouse View Post
I know ace he'll be fine.
Great.

Originally Posted by lakehouse View Post
I've been at envoy for 6 years, through all the he ll years. At this point things have returned back to a more normal place. Eagle or envoy have never been a bad place to work, even now. Yes it sucks for awhile when management touches things and shakes the hive. Yes management needs to fix the schedules and throw some kind of cash to short term recruit to fix the upgrade time. However that's it, you fix those two and maybe open back up a baseor two and we will be right back on level with endeavour and skywest. It's really frustrating because we are such an easy few decisions and costs from being a great place again. Hopefully management wakes up.
In reading this paragraph, in my opinion from what I've heard on forums and talking to Envoy pilots directly, your assessment of present Envoy seems to be the distinct minority. AFAIC, from my assessment, the ills you describe are not just "things management needs to do", but something far more systemic in their relationship with their pilots which to me appears quite dysfunctional. From past experience there (which sounds leaps and bounds better then the present), pilots lived up to 95% of their bargain with management and the reverse was less than 50%. I think management needs to FAR more then just to "wake up". But hey, sooner or later they WILL have no choice but to as their future is now assured. The pilots just aren't coming to regionals anymore and I think Envoy will be among the first to reach a crisis considering their present size and present feed responsibilities.

Good luck to you too. I think you'll need it.
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:38 AM
  #3580  
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Originally Posted by eaglefly View Post
Great.



In reading this paragraph, in my opinion from what I've heard on forums and talking to Envoy pilots directly, your assessment of present Envoy seems to be the distinct minority. AFAIC, from my assessment, the ills you describe are not just "things management needs to do", but something far more systemic in their relationship with their pilots which to me appears quite dysfunctional. From past experience there (which sounds leaps and bounds better then the present), pilots lived up to 95% of their bargain with management and the reverse was less than 50%. I think management needs to FAR more then just to "wake up". But hey, sooner or later they WILL have no choice but to as their future is now assured. The pilots just aren't coming to regionals anymore and I think Envoy will be among the first to reach a crisis considering their present size and present feed responsibilities.

Good luck to you too. I think you'll need it.
So what is the solution? Because at this point, I think it is simply too late to just raise pay and throw bigger bonuses at the problem. What do you see AAG doing? Because they certainly aren't buying any more group 1 aircraft for the foreseeable future.
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