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Old 08-23-2019, 04:59 AM
  #8291  
The REAL Bluedriver
 
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Originally Posted by Southerner View Post
As usual, you are missing the point.
Do you have to be a Richard? I was disagreeing without making it personal.

And unless you explain further, I do not think I'm missing the point. I said that the data change showing less overtime being worked alone is not enough. And that is correct.
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Old 08-23-2019, 06:41 AM
  #8292  
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Originally Posted by Southerner View Post
Listen to what some of you are saying...to paraphrase:

"I know that what I want to do is illegal, but I don't care because I don't think there will be consequences."

Then you'll turn around 5 minutes later and complain that the company violates the CBA because they don't think there will be consequences.

Either principles matter, or they don't. If they don't matter to you, then stop complaining about the company pushing the limits of the CBA. Be consistent.
That's nonsense. I could have a high degree of personal integrity (and I do) and still lose out badly because the other much larger party is cheating (and they are). It's not a matter of upholding principles so much as executing successful game theory. In this scenario, it pays to change the pattern of our individual behavior since the other party has already cheated, repeatedly. It's not violating any principles to point that out and encourage it.
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Old 08-27-2019, 08:37 AM
  #8293  
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Originally Posted by Southerner View Post
Listen to what some of you are saying...to paraphrase:

"I know that what I want to do is illegal, but I don't care because I don't think there will be consequences."

Then you'll turn around 5 minutes later and complain that the company violates the CBA because they don't think there will be consequences.

Either principle matter, or they don't. If they don't matter to you, then stop complaining about the company pushing the limits of the CBA. Be consistent.
The other side uses the entire legal process to determine what is unlawful or lawful. It's a sport!

That is 'good business' or management. The process is deliberate and long toward a determination of what is lawful or not.

Not a poster on the bulletin board saying like a kindergartner "you cheated".

To not use the ENTIRE process toward determining if and action is unlawful or lawful is giving away the store and disarming this group.

They know it and so do you.
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Old 08-27-2019, 02:40 PM
  #8294  
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Originally Posted by BlueJetDork View Post
The other side uses the entire legal process to determine what is unlawful or lawful. It's a sport!

That is 'good business' or management. The process is deliberate and long toward a determination of what is lawful or not.

Not a poster on the bulletin board saying like a kindergartner "you cheated".

To not use the ENTIRE process toward determining if and action is unlawful or lawful is giving away the store and disarming this group.

They know it and so do you.
I'm not going to violate labor laws just because the other side chooses to play dirty. Thankfully, our ALPA MEC agrees.
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Old 08-27-2019, 02:58 PM
  #8295  
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How would you do that?

Self declare?

The first step in the process is a hearing after which the judge orders the union to write a letter to tell the group to stop doing whatever the courts thinks the group is doing.

You wildcatting is way down the line and you being held personally accountable is even further down the line.
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Old 08-27-2019, 04:13 PM
  #8296  
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Originally Posted by Southerner View Post
I'm not going to violate labor laws just because the other side chooses to play dirty. Thankfully, our ALPA MEC agrees.
What do you define as something Southerner personally won't do (in violation of labor laws)?

As an example?
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Old 08-27-2019, 06:11 PM
  #8297  
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Originally Posted by Bluedriver View Post
What do you define as something Southerner personally won't do (in violation of labor laws)?

As an example?
Encourage illegal job actions on a public forum. Sorry, I thought that was pretty clear.
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Old 08-27-2019, 08:14 PM
  #8298  
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Originally Posted by Southerner View Post
Encourage illegal job actions on a public forum...
"Watch out, sharp corner ahead"!!!



Pullover NOW!
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Old 08-28-2019, 04:24 AM
  #8299  
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Originally Posted by Southerner View Post
Encourage illegal job actions on a public forum. Sorry, I thought that was pretty clear.
No, that's not what I thought you were saying. I also try not to specifically "call" for an illegal job action in permanent 1's & 0's.

Entirely as an example, if Southerner normally picks up 1-2 OT shifts per month and then during the next labor dispute, should the company decide to stall and play games, Southerner's ***personal GAS meter*** pegges full "Empty", would you consider it an "illegal job action" (specifically something you won't do?) to simply be off on your designated "off" days?
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Old 08-30-2019, 08:29 AM
  #8300  
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Originally Posted by Bluedriver View Post
No, that's not what I thought you were saying. I also try not to specifically "call" for an illegal job action in permanent 1's & 0's.

Entirely as an example, if Southerner normally picks up 1-2 OT shifts per month and then during the next labor dispute, should the company decide to stall and play games, Southerner's ***personal GAS meter*** pegges full "Empty", would you consider it an "illegal job action" (specifically something you won't do?) to simply be off on your designated "off" days?
No, but if the company can point to dumba$$ pilot posting on a web board suggesting that not picking up trips might be a good idea then all bets are off.

In short, just stop the job action posts
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